It's time for a discusion about etiquette.

[jemagirl (imported)]

Not so long ago one of my forum friends quit coming to the EA. several of us wondered what had happened to her and if she was alright. In fact there was a whole thread on the matter. I am speaking of Punky pink. Today I noticed that she had posted and then a moment later I saw that she had been banned. So I decided to look at her most recent posts and find out why.

The first thing about the forum is that we have moderators who work very hard at keeping things civil. Theirs is a thankless task and a very tedious one. Whether you are right or wrong in a debate is one thing, but you are always in the wrong if you are making such a difficult job even harder for the moderator, and you are the one who will come up on the loosing end. I understand why Punky pink was banned, but still I am sorry to see her go.

If it were all this simple that would be the end of it and I wouldn't have bothered to post, but this issue is a lot bigger than one person getting banned for poking their finger in the eye of a moderator. The EA is supposed to be a friendly place where we can discuss things and feel safe. We are lucky to have a forum like this and we need to take care of it and keep it inclusive. It is not just the job of the moderators to keep things civil and friendly. It is also our job to keep this forum safe, friendly and inclusive.

To some degree we all self moderate. There are words that we all agree not to use. I will forgo making a list as we all pretty much know what they are. We know that when we use these words it hurts people, and we don't want to hurt others nor do we want to cause offense. Unfortunately despite our own best efforts, and without any malice of forethought, we say and wright things that hurt other members of our community. We do this because we have inherited a lexicon that is from a less than perfect past. There are words in it that were intended to put people into categories and assign them a class or status in society.

Most of the time we use these words without thinking of the original intent. We forget that many of these words were intended to keep a certain social order, and to sanction those who challenged that order. But our society today is not the one that our parents lived in. We live in a much more tolerant society than did our parents. We here on the EA share the special distinction of benefiting from this and understanding how much further there is to go. As we have this understanding, it falls upon us to conduct ourselves in a way befitting our special place in history. In short we need to make the effort to be fair and equitable in our conduct and in our speech so that we help build a society that not only accepts our diversity but is open to the diversity of others. If we do not do this, then truly we are hypocrites. I do not want to be the person demanding my own equality in this society while at the same time I am denigrating someone else for being different.

Now let me be clear on this matter. There are the ways we hurt other, and it should be noted that there is a diference between hurting someone on purpose and doing it unintentionally. When it is done intentionally it needs to be delt with differently than when the hurt was not intentional. When someone causes offense with the intention of hurting another, this is a matter that need the attention of a moderator. I notice the moderators here are very quick to take action on such occasions. Instead of getting embroiled in a flame war or tangling with a troll, just report the matter to a mod, and move on.

But there are the times when people hurt others without meaning to. That lexicon we've inhabited has an awfull lot of awful words that we don't see for what they are. Form time to time we are going to cause offense to others without intention, and in the same way we will be hurt by others who are not trying to hurt us. In such cases we need to take the right action to remedy the situation in a way that raises us all up to a higher level of understanding and compassion.

My heartfelt advice to all who will surly find themselves on either side of this hurt is to practice patience and compassion. Now you may think I am asking for patience on behalf of the person who caused the hurt, and for compassion by the person who was hurt toward the person who caused the hurt, but in fact we all need to be patient with each other, and we all need to be compassionate toward each other, no matter what side of the hurt we find ourselves on.

We don't need to wait for the next flame war to start before we put this into practice. We can practice compassion now by understanding that our words can hurt others, and by choosing better ones. We have the power to take these words out of our own lexicon, and as a forum and a community we can take them out of circulation. That is the compassionate and right thing to do. This won't happen in the blink of an eye, so let us also be patient with each other.

Up until this moment I have avoided using the word tranny, because I know it offends and causes hurt to others, but at some point the word needs to be said if only to say that it should be removed from use. If everyone does this then the EA will be a safer more welcoming place for everyone. Just remember that the words you use say a lot about who you are as a person. I hope they say you are a compassionate, loving and fair human being.

[Riverwind (imported)]

First you are right that we should have a discussion about etiquette here on the board, what word offend and why as we have tried to make this a friendly place for everybody and all walks of life. We are straight, gay, transgendered, bi, post opp, pr opp, old, young, middle aged, use English as a first language, use English as the only language and the list goes on.

If somebody makes a mistake there is a right way and wrong way to say that its offensive, Punkypink is a loose cannon ready to go off at a moments notice to anybody and everybody who she thinks is offending her, without realizing that she is doing the same.

Just for the record, several of us ops had our finger on the red KILL button but were not fast enough. We never like to ban people but when a person is so disruptive to the flow of the boards then they will be ban and rightly so, as we must look out for the welfare of all our members over just one, in this case it was not the first time a moderator has talked to her about her posts, like all things its always a last straw kind of thing. In this case enough was more then enough and we wish her well however suspect that this will be a life problem for her.

So back to etiquette, maybe we should have a thread that shows,

Trans = bad, Transgendered = good

and so on, I am not up on all of them and over the years have made my mistakes so in the spirit of Jema's suggestion lets use this to list them all and when complete we can put it together in one place.

River

[hazbalz (imported)]

I agree entirely with Jema and River. A discussion on words and their meaning is very important and needed. Punky initially made a good point about the word "tranny." Personally, I was not aware it was offensive to some and appreciate learning something new and important. (As an example, I don't like the word "handicapped," preferring "disabled" or "challenged.") It could have been a good teaching moment and provided some good insight and discussion. Jema, you give some sage advice to "practice patience and compassion." If only we all were so wise.

[jemagirl (imported)]

Here is the question: Shall we have a list knowing that it will never be complete, or shall we practice patience and compassion knowing we can never be as patient or compassionate as we need to be?

[Sweetpickle (imported)]

Are you saying we should not speak of MacWolf's age, looks and personality?

[Uncle Flo (imported)]

Here is the question: Shall we have a list knowing that it will never be complete, or shall we practice patience and compassion knowing we can never be as patient or compassionate as we need to be?

I am of the opinion that we always need to be tolerant and flexible in regard to the speech and opinions of others on the message boards; if I were not exercising restraint at all times there would, indeed, be very few people posting here. I do not think we need a list, I think we each need to examine our language and our behavior more closely. We don't need a list - we need consideration of others. --FLO--

[Paolo]

What it boils down to is this:

I was the one who banned PunkyPink, and I almost did it on her next to last post - but I didn't.

I invited her to use the door, and she didn't.

Instead, she did her usual thing - coming onto the forum finding offense in everything, stirring up tension, pouring derision on everything, and as usual, taking offense. It seemed that the only reason she was coming here was to try and start fights.

I'm sorry your friend has such issues, and maybe if she'd taken your advice and been a bit more polite HERSELF, none of this would have happened.

But I'll come right out and be totally honest, and probably offending - what she needs is a good slap to knock some sense into her. I've met a LOT of people who offended me, both in person and online, and I have to say, she's goddamn near the top of the list.

[moi621 (imported)]

PunkyP is very thin skinned. I could never achieve a PM without committing foot in mouth.

If I were asked or suggested to avoid some term I never regarded as derogatory, I would.

I would not take responsibility over another going off the deep end over a "word".

I hope someone better acquainted with PunkP then I will do some therapeutic outreach,

and maybe "rehabilitate" her membership.

I remember some good PunkyP times when she shared how she could tease.

Going Transgender must be a really, really difficult life commitment. They are brave people.

Sincerely

Moi

[jemagirl (imported)]

On Punky's part I would say that she could have handled things much differently and I don't fault Palo for banning her. However I do wish people would stop using the term tranny as it is as offensive as any racial or ethnic epithet. Would we be as harsh on another member if they were responding to the word faggot or the N word? Would we tolerate any thread where that were in the subject line? I agree that we don't need a list, but we should also need raise our own level of conduct, such that when we see someone using hurtful language, that we do not remain silent.

[Eunuchorn (imported)]

Um, Does this mean we can't ever have a discussion about the automotive product that Aamco services? (the one between the engine and the universal shaft?)