Eunuch Defined

[Tracy1980 (imported)]

I would think that a biological male based on original plumbing who undergoes castration is still physically a male, just without the testicles. If the definition of a eunuch is a male without testicles, then one would be a male eunuch to be more exact. Is a male eunuch a separate gender from male and female? In my personal opinion, I do not think so. If a man has to undergo castration because he has prostate cancer, this act I do not think places him another gender category. He is a biological male without testicles. If this example is agreed upon, then why would a voluntary castration be any different?

[mrt (imported)]

I would think that a biological male based on original plumbing who undergoes castration is still physically a male, just without the testicles. If the definition of a eunuch is a male without testicles, then one would be a male eunuch to be more exact. Is a male eunuch a separate gender from male and female? In my personal opinion, I do not think so. If a man has to undergo castration because he has prostate cancer, this act I do not think places him another gender category. He is a biological male without testicles. If this example is agreed upon, then why would a voluntary castration be any different?

I think that a person who is castrated before puberty is a Eunuch. Regardless if they were born male or female. I think that once a person developes fully and looses his / her testicles they are in a slightly different catagory. But by how we define the word still a Eunuch. I think labels like this limit us however. Just as I think calling a person a Transexual after hormone therapy and SRS is not quite right. In that case the "trans" part is done. But now I'm off on a tangent...

[Tracy1980 (imported)]

I think that a person who is castrated before puberty is a Eunuch. Regardless if they were born male or female. I think that once a person developes fully and looses his / her testicles they are in a slightly different catagory. But by how we define the word still a Eunuch. I think labels like this limit us however. Just as I think calling a person a Transexual after hormone therapy and SRS is not quite right. In that case the "trans" part is done. But now I'm off on a tangent...

I would have to disagree. Whether or not someone gets castrated pre or post-puberty I think does not matter. Both are still male eunuchs. Yes, there will most likely be a physical difference between the pre and post-puberty eunuchs in that that pre-puberty eunuch will have less masculine physical traits, but both are still male eunuchs because both have been castrated.

I can compare this reasoning to male to female transsexuals. MtF transsexuals who transition pre-puberty often become very passable females, whereas MtF transsexuals who transition post-puberty have a more difficult time passing in the female gender. In either case, the pre-puberty MtF transsexuals are no more of a transsexual than the post-puberty MtF transsexuals.

[plix (imported)]

I suppose techically you would have to be castrated pre-puberty to truly be a "eunuch" in the traditional sense of the word. Once your body has undergone irreversible masculinization, such as voices, bones, and face, then you can't technically be a true "eunuch" anymore if you are defining eunuch from a medical standpoint as one who posesses eunuchoid features. But I don't find all those technicalities to be necessary. If a man who has his nuts cut off after puberty wants to call himself a eunuch, I don't see anything wrong with it.

Voluntary castration is different because you are dealing with a completely different set of issues. With the guy getting cut for prostate cancer, he absolutely does not want to cut and finds his new state shameful. He speaks of it to no one and tries to go on living his life as a normal man.

As for the guy who chooses to get cut, he has a wide variety of reasons for wanting this. Sure there are some who will continue indentifying as men after the cut when it is reasons like overactive libido or body modification issues, but some identify as "eunuch" as an indentity or some other non-male identity, and they want to be cut for these reasons. Getting cut because you have prostate cancer and getting cut because you identify as a third gender are quite different, and they should not be confused.

If you define eunuch as a man without testicles, then male eunuch is redundant. Eunuch implies biological male, and I do not really see a need for the term "male eunuch."

[Tracy1980 (imported)]

I suppose techically you would have to be castrated pre-puberty to truly be a "eunuch" in the traditional sense of the word. Once your body has undergone irreversible masculinization, such as voices, bones, and face, then you can't technically be a true "eunuch" anymore if you are defining eunuch from a medical standpoint as one who posesses eunuchoid features. But I don't find all those technicalities to be necessary. If a man who has his nuts cut off after puberty wants to call himself a eunuch, I don't see anything wrong with it.

Voluntary castration is different because you are dealing with a completely different set of issues. With the guy getting cut for prostate cancer, he absolutely does not want to cut and finds his new state shameful. He speaks of it to no one and tries to go on living his life as a normal man.

As for the guy who chooses to get cut, he has a wide variety of reasons for wanting this. Sure there are some who will continue indentifying as men after the cut when it is reasons like overactive libido or body modification issues, but some identify as "eunuch" as an indentity or some other non-male identity, and they want to be cut for these reasons. Getting cut because you have prostate cancer and getting cut because you identify as a third gender are quite different, and they should not be confused.

If you define eunuch as a man without testicles, then male eunuch is redundant. Eunuch implies biological male, and I do not really see a need for the term "male eunuch."

So would you define the guy who cuts for prostate cancer and tries going on with his life as a normal man a eunuch? Or would you consider him not a eunuch because he did the cut involuntarily?

[kristoff]

Some folks hijacked an unrelated thread I started a long time ago. When you wish to do that, start your own thread. Content moved here.