• Testosterone question Help needed

Posted: **Fri Oct 12, 2018 5:30 am**

Hi everybody

I am hope someone maybe able to help.

I was surgically castrated in Dec 2017 and have been put on testosterone gel which seems to be ok (cant get levels right but not a problem) but I find if I use it I get massive headaches everyday, but if I don't use it for a few weeks the headaches disappear.

Has anyone else had the same problem and what's the best way to get around the headaches?

Many Thanks

Posted: **Fri Oct 12, 2018 8:39 am**

Hey @horny_lynne,

I've been on Androgel for about 20 years. I have no need nor desire to be castrated. My numbers were just very low and needed a boost. Yes, I do get headaches if my numbers are too high. My endocrinologist test my levels about every 6 months (or more if I'm having a problems).

The newest version of Androgel is not as easy to adjust the dose. The older version was about half as strong and the normal does was 4 pumps a day. So there was more granularity in moving up or down a bit.

For example, on the older four pump Androgel if the doctor wanted to move the dose down just a bit:

From 4 pumps every day TO 3 pumps on odd days of the month and 4 pumps on even days was a reduction to 87.5% of the prior dose

From 4 pumps every day to 3 pumps every day was a reduction to 75% of the prior dose.

It worked the same going up as it did going down.

With the newer Pump it's more difficult to dial in the exact amount as the standard dose is 2 pumps a day.

So, to reduce to 1 pump a day is a 50% reduction. Reducing to 1 pump on odd days of the month and 2 pumps on even days is a 75% reduction. There's no intermediate step between 50% and 75% unless the formula for one pump or two pumps gets really complicated.

At first I was lazy about using the gel at exactly as directed. I didn't use a washcloth to get rid of dead skin and apply it right after a shower. Also, I wasn't very good about putting the gel on first thing in the morning.

So, I learned to shower and put on the gel at about the same time every day. The natural cycle for testosterone in a male is that it's highest in the morning, because it's made while we sleep.

It's helped reduce the headaches because the blood work is able to find spikes. Also, I notice when the headaches start and I can phone the doctor and reduce the dose or skip a day or two.

My doctor said the only other option was injections. However, I found a compounding pharmacy nearby. My partner uses them to have his testosterone cream compounded. I've never used them, but they could compound a percent of testosterone that would allow a more precise dose.

Right now I'm on one pump on odd days of the month and two pumps on even days and the headaches are better

One last point. When I first went on Androgel, I was having headaches (more behind the eyes). My doctor at that time told me to get my eyes checked. He was right, a change in my glasses and contacts and the headaches stopped. So, it might not be the gel.

Why were you castrated? Injury?

Posted: **Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:25 pm**

Hi,

I would go back to your doctor and ask about thim.

I been using it for a couple to years and dont have any problem.

With ghe testogel in the pump pack i can use what i like most times 4 pumps a day , have gone down to 1 pump wgich gives me a vety low dose anf its like having no testosterone at allor you can go up to what ever you like have done 10 pjmp a day for a month wow felt vetty horny all the time.

Posted: **Sat Oct 13, 2018 6:08 am**

Hi Topman

Thanks so much for your long and detailed reply.

I have had my eyes tested recently and that is not the problem, I think I will need to cut down my dose as you suggest and maybe only use the testogel every other day and see if that makes a difference.

I was on Androcur for almost 2 years and thought that I would inject Calcium Chloride as the cost of Androcur was getting quite expensive for me and I injected to much which caused many problems with leakage etc and so I was surgically castrated.

TopManFL (imported) wrote: Fri Oct 12, 2018 8:39 am Hey @horny_lynne,

I've been on Androgel for about 20 years. I have no need nor desire to be castrated. My numbers were just very low and needed a boost. Yes, I do get headaches if my numbers are too high. My endocrinologist test my levels about every 6 months (or more if I'm having a problems).

The newest version of Androgel is not as easy to adjust the dose. The older version was about half as strong and the normal does was 4 pumps a day. So there was more granularity in moving up or down a bit.

For example, on the older four pump Androgel if the doctor wanted to move the dose down just a bit:

From 4 pumps every day TO 3 pumps on odd days of the month and 4 pumps on even days was a reduction to 87.5% of the prior dose

From 4 pumps every day to 3 pumps every day was a reduction to 75% of the prior dose.

It worked the same going up as it did going down.

With the newer Pump it's more difficult to dial in the exact amount as the standard dose is 2 pumps a day.

So, to reduce to 1 pump a day is a 50% reduction. Reducing to 1 pump on odd days of the month and 2 pumps on even days is a 75% reduction. There's no intermediate step between 50% and 75% unless the formula for one pump or two pumps gets really complicated.

At first I was lazy about using the gel at exactly as directed. I didn't use a washcloth to get rid of dead skin and apply it right after a shower. Also, I wasn't very good about putting the gel on first thing in the morning.

So, I learned to shower and put on the gel at about the same time every day. The natural cycle for testosterone in a male is that it's highest in the morning, because it's made while we sleep.

It's helped reduce the headaches because the blood work is able to find spikes. Also, I notice when the headaches start and I can phone the doctor and reduce the dose or skip a day or two.

My doctor said the only other option was injections. However, I found a compounding pharmacy nearby. My partner uses them to have his testosterone cream compounded. I've never used them, but they could compound a percent of testosterone that would allow a more precise dose.

Right now I'm on one pump on odd days of the month and two pumps on even days and the headaches are better

One last point. When I first went on Androgel, I was having headaches (more behind the eyes). My doctor at that time told me to get my eyes checked. He was right, a change in my glasses and contacts and the headaches stopped. So, it might not be the gel.

Why were you castrated? Injury?

Posted: **Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:39 am**

I was on the "old" Androgel for several years until I was switched to the new strength one. I did not have any problems with it, I guess because instead of using the 4.5 strength dose (2 pumps) I only used on for 20.25 per dose. Then my Insurance sort of "demanded I change to Fortesta. That comes in a 10mg dose per pump.

I am currently using 1 pump 10mg a day 4 days a week and 2 pumps 20 mg. three days a week. I hve done 2 pumps daily for two weeks at a stretch. then back to the original schedule. I have also missed days occasionally. I don't find I feel any better or worse doing that. Missing usually is done when traveling or just deciding not to apply it. I did go 10 days once and caould feel the difference by day 10. At my age (80) one doctor sais I could quit it altogether but can't seem to make myself do that yet. If i could get a penectomy I might be more inclined to forgo trt. I am thinking of going to 10mg every other day to see how it works out. I ca always go back to the original schedule if I feel I have to.

Posted: **Sat Oct 13, 2018 2:59 pm**

Have you had your estradiol level checked? If that is getting elevated with your use of the gel it could be causing the headaches

Posted: **Sat Oct 13, 2018 11:25 pm**

Thanks I will talk to doctor and get that checked.

Wolf-Pup (imported) wrote: Sat Oct 13, 2018 2:59 pm Have you had your estradiol level checked? If that is getting elevated with your use of the gel it could be causing the headaches

Posted: **Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:38 am**

It is the main form of estrogen. The body converts testosterone to it. When you are on external T it is something that can need to be part of the equation. If the body thinks it has too much T it can then create too much E. One possible side effect of elevated estrogen can be headaches.

Also have you tried a different kind of gel, there could be an ingredient you are allergic to that is causing the headaches.

Posted: **Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:41 am**

Thank you Wolf-Pup

The doctor here only seems to think there is only one type of Gel but of course there is oral and injectable stuff as well.

I may just go no T at all and see what happens.

Wolf-Pup (imported) wrote: Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:38 am It is the main form of estrogen. The body converts testosterone to it. When you are on external T it is something that can need to be part of the equation. If the body thinks it has too much T it can then create too much E. One possible side effect of elevated estrogen can be headaches.

Also have you tried a different kind of gel, there could be an ingredient you are allergic to that is causing the headaches.

Posted: **Mon Oct 15, 2018 3:04 am**

If you can get on injectables an average start dose is about 100mg per week and the doc tweaks things from there.

It is a good idea to have blood tests done after the first month of starting anything new.

On the subject of blood tests some times your red cell count can go high on TRT so its worth getting that checked out.

I try to keep this in check by donating blood every 4 months.

If you do decide to give the no T a try I would suggest slowly ramping down your intake.

Give it a few months to stabilise and make your mind up from there.

Of coarse be mindful of the health issues.

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