I'm looking for a new laptop computer (not a tablet - that's later) - old one is about 8 years - terrible. Terrible terrible performance at recent trade show. Do NOT like windows 8. Any discussion in understandable terms about hardware/software suggestions. Keep in mind, I am a reformed psychologist who functions now (among other things) as a tax accountant. I don't understand "lingo." Talk to me.
K
New Laptop
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Dave (imported)
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Re: New Laptop
>>I own a Mac. I know what you are going to say. They are expensive.
>>
>>
http://blogs.computerworld.com/windows/ ... -warns-idc
Windows 8 is depressing PC sales in record numbers, warns IDC
By Preston Gralla
April 10, 2013 5:20 PM EDT22 Comments
.
PC sales are plummeting because consumers are confused and unhappy with Windows 8, and there's no end in sight. So concludes an IDC report, which says the sinking sales are the worst it's ever seen.
The IDC report found that worldwide PC shipments were 76.3 million units in 2013's first quarter, down 13.9% from a year previous, and even worse than the 7.7% decline that IDC had forecast. The drop is the worst that IDC has ever seen since it began tracking the PC market each quarter in 1995. It's also the fourth straight quarter that PC sales have declined year-on-year.
That's only the start of the bad news for Microsoft. IDC concludes that that decline has been fueled by the poor design and failure of Windows 8, not just by the increasing popularity of tablets. Bob O'Donnell, IDC Program Vice President, Clients and Displays had these harsh words for Windows 8 and Microsoft:
"At this point, unfortunately, it seems clear that the Windows 8 launch not only failed to provide a positive boost to the PC market, but appears to have slowed the market. While some consumers appreciate the new form factors and touch capabilities of Windows 8, the radical changes to the UI, removal of the familiar Start button, and the costs associated with touch have made PCs a less attractive alternative to dedicated tablets and other competitive devices. Microsoft will have to make some very tough decisions moving forward if it wants to help reinvigorate the PC market."
O'Donnell expanded on Windows 8's failings in an interview with the Seattle Times:
"While people like the general look and feel of the tiles, theyre also very confused and frustrated by the lack of start menu and spend a lot of their time in (traditional) desktop mode. So the bottom line is I think they have created a situation where its very difficult for people and people who have a PC that works just fine are saying its confusing, it costs more money and I dont really need it."
O'Donnell and others at IDC believe that unless Microsoft makes serious changes to Windows 8 to make it more familiar and consumer-friendly, things will only get worse. Jay Chou, senior research analyst on IDCs quarterly PC tracking service, said:
"Although IDC had not expected Windows 8 to be a significant driver to help stem the tide of PC volume decline, it now appears that without a course correction from Microsoft, the PC market is headed toward an even worse contraction for 2013 than previously thought."
O'Donnell adds that he doesn't expect Microsoft to admit its mistakes and make significant changes, telling the Seattle Times:
"I think this is the pride before the fall because they are unwilling to make those changes, because it would show them as having given up or lost on their radical new vision."
O'Donnell is right. Microsoft made a big gamble in designing Windows 8 as an operating system designed more for tablets and touch than for traditional PCs, and in giving it dueling and confusing interfaces. Microsoft hoped that familiarizing people with the touch interface would spur people to buy Windows 8 and Windows Rt tablets, but that hasn't happened. Now it appears that Windows 8 is helping to significantly depress sales of traditional PCs as well.
Microsoft should admit its mistake and redesign Windows 8 so that people want to buy PCs based on it. To keep Windows 8 the way it is will only hurt sales even more.
>>
>>
http://blogs.computerworld.com/windows/ ... -warns-idc
Windows 8 is depressing PC sales in record numbers, warns IDC
By Preston Gralla
April 10, 2013 5:20 PM EDT22 Comments
.
PC sales are plummeting because consumers are confused and unhappy with Windows 8, and there's no end in sight. So concludes an IDC report, which says the sinking sales are the worst it's ever seen.
The IDC report found that worldwide PC shipments were 76.3 million units in 2013's first quarter, down 13.9% from a year previous, and even worse than the 7.7% decline that IDC had forecast. The drop is the worst that IDC has ever seen since it began tracking the PC market each quarter in 1995. It's also the fourth straight quarter that PC sales have declined year-on-year.
That's only the start of the bad news for Microsoft. IDC concludes that that decline has been fueled by the poor design and failure of Windows 8, not just by the increasing popularity of tablets. Bob O'Donnell, IDC Program Vice President, Clients and Displays had these harsh words for Windows 8 and Microsoft:
"At this point, unfortunately, it seems clear that the Windows 8 launch not only failed to provide a positive boost to the PC market, but appears to have slowed the market. While some consumers appreciate the new form factors and touch capabilities of Windows 8, the radical changes to the UI, removal of the familiar Start button, and the costs associated with touch have made PCs a less attractive alternative to dedicated tablets and other competitive devices. Microsoft will have to make some very tough decisions moving forward if it wants to help reinvigorate the PC market."
O'Donnell expanded on Windows 8's failings in an interview with the Seattle Times:
"While people like the general look and feel of the tiles, theyre also very confused and frustrated by the lack of start menu and spend a lot of their time in (traditional) desktop mode. So the bottom line is I think they have created a situation where its very difficult for people and people who have a PC that works just fine are saying its confusing, it costs more money and I dont really need it."
O'Donnell and others at IDC believe that unless Microsoft makes serious changes to Windows 8 to make it more familiar and consumer-friendly, things will only get worse. Jay Chou, senior research analyst on IDCs quarterly PC tracking service, said:
"Although IDC had not expected Windows 8 to be a significant driver to help stem the tide of PC volume decline, it now appears that without a course correction from Microsoft, the PC market is headed toward an even worse contraction for 2013 than previously thought."
O'Donnell adds that he doesn't expect Microsoft to admit its mistakes and make significant changes, telling the Seattle Times:
"I think this is the pride before the fall because they are unwilling to make those changes, because it would show them as having given up or lost on their radical new vision."
O'Donnell is right. Microsoft made a big gamble in designing Windows 8 as an operating system designed more for tablets and touch than for traditional PCs, and in giving it dueling and confusing interfaces. Microsoft hoped that familiarizing people with the touch interface would spur people to buy Windows 8 and Windows Rt tablets, but that hasn't happened. Now it appears that Windows 8 is helping to significantly depress sales of traditional PCs as well.
Microsoft should admit its mistake and redesign Windows 8 so that people want to buy PCs based on it. To keep Windows 8 the way it is will only hurt sales even more.
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gareth19 (imported)
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Re: New Laptop
kristoff wrote: Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:52 pm I'm looking for a new laptop computer (not a tablet - that's later) - old one is about 8 years - terrible. Terrible terrible performance at recent trade show. Do NOT like windows 8. Any discussion in understandable terms about hardware/software suggestions. Keep in mind, I am a reformed psychologist who functions now (among other things) as a tax accountant. I don't understand "lingo." Talk to me.
K
Unless you are a Mac user, you'd better accept Windows 8. When I bought my new computer last month, the only PCs Fry was selling were loaded with Windows 8. It is an awful system, filled with useless bells and whistles and concealing important functions. Probably designed by the same cretins who thought up Microsoft Word. There are a bunch of useless "tiles" all over the screen to instantly connect you with Facebook and other crap. You can shift some of the tiles to icons on the toolbar and if you swipe the mouse along the right margin you can access the functions that really matter like the power icon to shut the thing off. After a while you will learn where to find the things that matter and you can ignore all the rest. That's what I do.
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foxytaur (imported)
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Re: New Laptop
well only thing i can recommend is the transformer infinity. If you really tweak the thing. it makes for a really good quasi
tablet/laptop device.
Wait for the new snapdragon 800 or tegra 4 processors. Id say when these come out it'll be worthwhile to given them a chance.
My transformer prime(heavily tweaked and modded) can run at a decent 9-11 hrs on max peformance overclocked watching a hidef 1080i video.
tablet/laptop device.
Wait for the new snapdragon 800 or tegra 4 processors. Id say when these come out it'll be worthwhile to given them a chance.
My transformer prime(heavily tweaked and modded) can run at a decent 9-11 hrs on max peformance overclocked watching a hidef 1080i video.
Re: New Laptop
I think that Microsoft has been taking lessons from Kodak on how to commit suicide.
You've got a product that people are used to. It's making money. Even with newer versions, it still looks pretty much the same and operates the same way. Now let's change it all around and hide half the features. Let's continually update it (like Kodak products) and keep a steep learning curve going to frustrate users. Let's make sure that people who work with custom or favorite software can't use it on the next update.
Ridiculous.
I guess I'll get to the point where I have to use Windows 7 someday, I have a new disc that's never been opened. I've seen 8, and I can't comprehend it. Guess when support for 7 is gone, I'll be offline then.
You've got a product that people are used to. It's making money. Even with newer versions, it still looks pretty much the same and operates the same way. Now let's change it all around and hide half the features. Let's continually update it (like Kodak products) and keep a steep learning curve going to frustrate users. Let's make sure that people who work with custom or favorite software can't use it on the next update.
Ridiculous.
I guess I'll get to the point where I have to use Windows 7 someday, I have a new disc that's never been opened. I've seen 8, and I can't comprehend it. Guess when support for 7 is gone, I'll be offline then.
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Sweetpickle (imported)
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Re: New Laptop
I have a Toshiba Satellite. It's cheap, speedy, plenty of disk, etc.
I don't know if you can still find one with W-7, but you might.
I don't know if you can still find one with W-7, but you might.
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Slammr (imported)
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Re: New Laptop
I installed Windows 8 on a perfectly good laptop running Windows 7, because I wanted to try it out. I don't hate it, but when I'm using that laptop - rarely anymore, because when I'm out and about I'm using a tablet, on which I can do about everything I can do on the laptop - I'm usually in the desktop mode and not using any Windows 8 features.
I have a Samsung Note 10.1 tablet,which I love and take everywhere with me. Given its predictive keyboard, I can write to a Word program on it almost as fast as I can write to one on the laptop. It seems to read my mind knowing what word I want to type next. It does learn from what one has typed previously. I have an IPad, but it remains at home, and I only use it for a few apps I can't get on the Android system.
I looked long and hard at both the Surface RT and Surface Pro, and I can see no reason to purchase either of them. I can type faster into a Word program on my Note 10.1 tablet than I can on either of them.
If I bought a new laptop, I would definitely get a touchscreen version. Windows 8 is a pain to use with only a mouse. I don't hate Windows 8, but I'm not a big fan of it either.
As far as I'm concerned, tablets have done away with my need for a laptop. I'm going on a trip next month and will probably take my laptop with me in case I want to run PhotoShop or one or two other programs, because I'll be gone from home for about a week and will probably be taking a bunch of pictures.
HP has a laptop with a screen that flips turning the whole thing into a tablet, but it's over $1000 and not as powerful as the laptop I have, so I see no reason to buy it. If I needed a laptop, it's probably the one I would buy.
Overall, I think the day of the p.c. is past. The first thing I pick up in the morning is my tablet. I surf the Web on it, read newspapers on it, read magazines on it, read books on it, watch videos on it, and play games on it. I don't remember when I last read a book, magazine, or newspaper printed on paper. I subscribe to a couple of magazines, but I get them digitally. One I get is National Geographic. The digital version includes videos and other interactive features one can't get from the regular magazine.
I have a Samsung Note 10.1 tablet,which I love and take everywhere with me. Given its predictive keyboard, I can write to a Word program on it almost as fast as I can write to one on the laptop. It seems to read my mind knowing what word I want to type next. It does learn from what one has typed previously. I have an IPad, but it remains at home, and I only use it for a few apps I can't get on the Android system.
I looked long and hard at both the Surface RT and Surface Pro, and I can see no reason to purchase either of them. I can type faster into a Word program on my Note 10.1 tablet than I can on either of them.
If I bought a new laptop, I would definitely get a touchscreen version. Windows 8 is a pain to use with only a mouse. I don't hate Windows 8, but I'm not a big fan of it either.
As far as I'm concerned, tablets have done away with my need for a laptop. I'm going on a trip next month and will probably take my laptop with me in case I want to run PhotoShop or one or two other programs, because I'll be gone from home for about a week and will probably be taking a bunch of pictures.
HP has a laptop with a screen that flips turning the whole thing into a tablet, but it's over $1000 and not as powerful as the laptop I have, so I see no reason to buy it. If I needed a laptop, it's probably the one I would buy.
Overall, I think the day of the p.c. is past. The first thing I pick up in the morning is my tablet. I surf the Web on it, read newspapers on it, read magazines on it, read books on it, watch videos on it, and play games on it. I don't remember when I last read a book, magazine, or newspaper printed on paper. I subscribe to a couple of magazines, but I get them digitally. One I get is National Geographic. The digital version includes videos and other interactive features one can't get from the regular magazine.
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Prudence (imported)
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Re: New Laptop
Take a look at Overstock.com -- it is one place where you can still get slightly older (ie: NOT WINDOWS 8) Laptops which are still new and under warranty.
As a general rule, in simple terms, I would look for something with these three (just about anything you'd buy that has these three will be good):
Either a Dual-Core or Quad-Core CPU, speed 2 Ghz or greater (preferably 2.4 Ghz or greater)
3 Gigs or more of Memory (preferably 4 gigs)
Windows 7
Screen Size -- your preference. I won't buy anything smaller than 15 inches (usually I go with 17). I don't mind a slightly larger Laptop, as long as I get a nice large screen.
In more specific/technical terms (if you want them):
CPU:
Intel Core2, i3, or i5
Or AMD "A" series or FX series.
AVOID: Intel Atom, Celeron, and Pentium (slow and cheap) and AMD Athlon, Turion, Sempron and most other AMD CPUs especially if below 2 GHz (again, slow and cheap).
OS:
Windows 7.
Windows XP is a possible second choice but be aware that Microsoft will stop supporting Win XP in 2014. In other words, no more fixes for "security holes" (exploits) which means you will be increasingly more suceptible to Malware/Viruses/etc.
AVOID: Windows Vista (too many problems) and Windows 8 (sucks)
RAM:
If you go with XP, 2 Gigs.
If you go with Windows 7, at least 3 Gigs if 32 bit. 4 Gigs or more if 64 bit.
If you get stuck with Vista you need around 8 Gigs (no exageration) to get it to perform decently (that is, close to what Windows 7 and Windows XP will give you).
I have no idea what Windows 8 needs, as I haven't worked much with that abomination. My guess would be 4 Gigs or more.
Hard Drive:
For most people 250 gigs or more is plenty (nearly anything you'd buy today is going to have this much).
It is better to go with 7200 RPM if you can find it.
If you are willing to pay the extra cash, a good SSD (Solid State Drive) will seriously and amazingly speed up the computer. It will also add at least $200 to $300 to the price tag... So if you see a "cheap" $400 or $500 laptop with an SSD, avoid it, they are probably using a cheap/slow SSD.
Video Card:
If you are just doing basic stuff (Websites, EMail, watching Video, Office Apps) any Video Card is fine.
If you play games or do 3D stuff, you'd want an NVidia or AMD/ATI Video Card (avoid the Intel ones, too slow for most 3D/Games).
As a general rule, in simple terms, I would look for something with these three (just about anything you'd buy that has these three will be good):
Either a Dual-Core or Quad-Core CPU, speed 2 Ghz or greater (preferably 2.4 Ghz or greater)
3 Gigs or more of Memory (preferably 4 gigs)
Windows 7
Screen Size -- your preference. I won't buy anything smaller than 15 inches (usually I go with 17). I don't mind a slightly larger Laptop, as long as I get a nice large screen.
In more specific/technical terms (if you want them):
CPU:
Intel Core2, i3, or i5
Or AMD "A" series or FX series.
AVOID: Intel Atom, Celeron, and Pentium (slow and cheap) and AMD Athlon, Turion, Sempron and most other AMD CPUs especially if below 2 GHz (again, slow and cheap).
OS:
Windows 7.
Windows XP is a possible second choice but be aware that Microsoft will stop supporting Win XP in 2014. In other words, no more fixes for "security holes" (exploits) which means you will be increasingly more suceptible to Malware/Viruses/etc.
AVOID: Windows Vista (too many problems) and Windows 8 (sucks)
RAM:
If you go with XP, 2 Gigs.
If you go with Windows 7, at least 3 Gigs if 32 bit. 4 Gigs or more if 64 bit.
If you get stuck with Vista you need around 8 Gigs (no exageration) to get it to perform decently (that is, close to what Windows 7 and Windows XP will give you).
I have no idea what Windows 8 needs, as I haven't worked much with that abomination. My guess would be 4 Gigs or more.
Hard Drive:
For most people 250 gigs or more is plenty (nearly anything you'd buy today is going to have this much).
It is better to go with 7200 RPM if you can find it.
If you are willing to pay the extra cash, a good SSD (Solid State Drive) will seriously and amazingly speed up the computer. It will also add at least $200 to $300 to the price tag... So if you see a "cheap" $400 or $500 laptop with an SSD, avoid it, they are probably using a cheap/slow SSD.
Video Card:
If you are just doing basic stuff (Websites, EMail, watching Video, Office Apps) any Video Card is fine.
If you play games or do 3D stuff, you'd want an NVidia or AMD/ATI Video Card (avoid the Intel ones, too slow for most 3D/Games).
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Wolf-Pup (imported)
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Re: New Laptop
I think Windows 7 is still available from a lot of PC makers. I tried Windows 8 for about 2 months. I never spent any time away from the regular desktop. I used Start8 to replace the missing start menu. However it just was flat. I missed things like the Aero Desktop graphics. Windows 7 has glamor for lack of a better word. Windows 8 was a visual step back and ugly in comparison. I went back to Windows 7 and have been quite happy ever since.
I never believed companies would opt to BUY Windows 8, and then have to PAY more money to re-train their entire workforce on how to use the new operating system. Its was stupid to take out the Start Menu and change how users at home and in the workplace access things.
I don't think finding a Windows 7 notebook would be very hard though.
I never believed companies would opt to BUY Windows 8, and then have to PAY more money to re-train their entire workforce on how to use the new operating system. Its was stupid to take out the Start Menu and change how users at home and in the workplace access things.
I don't think finding a Windows 7 notebook would be very hard though.
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speedvogel (imported)
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Re: New Laptop
I buy refurbished computers. I have had very good luck with them and spend very little money that way. Right now Tiger Direct is offering 22 pages of refurbished and off-lease laptops from all the major makers. Most are Windows 7 machines, which is OK, I guess. I still prefer Win2K as it was close to bulletproof and not cluttered with fluff.
Speed
Speed