Star Trek Into Darkness

[Riverwind (imported)]

On a guess I will take it that you did not like the movie.

Remember one mans Shakespeare is another mans Roddenberry.

River

[BossTamsin (imported)]

Bring me the severed genitals of JJ Abrams on a silver platter.

I whole-heartedly agree with you on this one. After years of promising that the 'big bad' wouldn't be Khan.... I was really pissed to find out that it was. It could have been literally anyone else and the movie would have worked better. Have it be one of Khan's compatriots. Have Khan still be one of the torpedosicles. Anyone but Khan Noonian Singh.

And let's not get into the huge frigging plot holes that you could pilot the Enterprise through. What plot holes? How about....

1) You can now beam from a damaged/crashing shuttlecraft in San Francisco, to an abandoned section of Kronos. Why the *@#$ are you gonna build starships if you can just BEAM around the galaxy? Who the hell cares if the Klingons are amassing a war fleet? Sit back, safe and cozy on Earth, and just beam waves of photon torpedoes onto their homeworld and into their spaceships until the surrender. Human casualties: 0

2) In the unlikely event that someone does happen to die, perhaps from a fatal sprain after pressing that 'transport' button one too many times, there's no need to worry! Khan's Magic Blood( (tm), (c), patent pending) will bring them straight back to life! No muss, no fuss, just one shot and the dead are resurrected. (Not guaranteed to work on red shirts, your mileage may vary.)

4) Death aside, Kirk's arc in this movie is damn near note for note his arc in the first movie. His story is still 'fuck-up learns a lesson and proves he can fill the chair'.

5) "Kirk, we want you and your crew to secretly cross the Neutral Zone, get within range of Kronos, locate Khan, and fire A top-secret stealth photon torpedo at him, killing him. This is a highly experimental prototype, fresh out of R&D. It's so top secret, nobody can look inside it. One should easily do the trick to kill one man, once you locate him. Oh, and for no particular reason, we're giving you 71 extras. Don't ask why." What? 72 torpedoes for a mission that requires one? Maybe two at most if you happen to miss the first time? I mean, let's be honest here, once shit starts blowing up on Kronos, the Klingons are gonna guess something's up. 72 stealth torpedoes are enough to decimate the planet, not kill one man.

I could go on, and I really would like to, but for the sake of my blood pressure, I'll stop there.

Suffice to say.... I'm not exactly looking forward to the next one. Which I'm betting will somehow be a remake of 'The Search for Spock'.

[Dave (imported)]

I look at it a little different than all that.

This is the retelling of the WRATH OF KAHN in the rebooted timeline.

Kirk never learned the lesson of command in the first movie of the rebooted timeline. He defeated Nero, the time traveler, with sheer gall and luck. He didn't command the ship. He kind of ran amok in the new timeline and got himself a command.

In "INTO DARKNESS" he is still playing the cowboy and womanizing clown with total disrespect aka "brat". Like Pike says at the beginning -- he's irresponsible and believes rules are for other people.

Now comes the frozen outcast KHAN in the rebooted universe.

The twist is that he isn't discovered on Ceti Alpha Five, and he isn't seeking the highly illegal "Genesis" Device. The twist is that Marcus is fomenting war with the Klingons. AS we know, in the broadest sense of time, Kirk will make PEACE with the Klingons but not if he fires that funky warhead with the hidden payload.

Spock is the person who questions the morality of the bombing run on Kronos. Spock is the conscience. Spock learned something from Pike -- he learned what it means to die. That parallels Nimoy's death in the first WRATH OF KHAN.

Scotty arguing that the mission is military and not exploration is a second poke at Kirk's conscience.

Kirk is so filled with revenge and hate of Khan for killing his father-figure and mentor PIKE that he almost lets KHAN use him for Khan's revenge by sheer lies and manipulation after they get off Kronos. Cumberbatch plays KHAN with the appropriate levels of sociopathic coldness and ruthlessness.

This is a man without a soul on a mission that ends only in the death of any lesser being...

Kirk is so consumed with sorrow and revenge that he's not ready.

All of this sets up the new Captain Kirk and new crew. The NERO Storyline of the first movie might have given Kirk a captaincy but this movie turns him into a captain. EVen the crew comes together in the movie. They know from the NERO storyline that Kirk is somehow lucky and/or brilliant in his tactics but they are not a crew until they depend on each other in this movie to defeat KHAN.

The new Bones McKoy complains that SULU is not ready for command but damn, his first commands are rock solid. He understands.

I think the cheesiest special effect is Kirk kicking the whatever the "F" that is. You'll understand when you see it.

I think that the repeat of the magnificent scene between Shatner and Nimoy -- I have been and always will be your friend" was childish, stupidly done and poorly conceived.

I think that the opening sequence or running away from a temple is a rippoff of Raiders of the Lost Ark and several other movies.

I think that the Klingon attack on the shuttle is too long. Also the jetting to Marcus's warship in spacesuits. Also the tumbling in the cargo bay. And Spock's final fight. Those scenes are all the same scenes.

So what I see as the essential morality play of good and evil is spoiled by all sorts of goofiness, interminable action sequences, and cheesy writing.

[Riverwind (imported)]

Well of course its cheese writing, when has it ever been different with Kirk? the old one or new one.

River

[moi621 (imported)]

When there was no Star Trek on TV, the first time

movies came along. With more movies came TV.

Lots and lots of Star Trek TV.

I Wonder

Will these new movies create means of production that will lead to more Star Trek TV ?

I favor Enterprise and DS9. Well not 9 since it got blown up.

Moi da trekie

[Riverwind (imported)]

I am with you moi, I am ready for another TV series that lasts 6 or 7 years followed by several more movies one of which has Khan in it.

River

[A-1 (imported)]

The trouble is that there will never be another opportunity to make the original series run longer on network T.V. All of the old T.V. series is available on Net Flicks, and the actors are young and in their prime.

The "vision" of network executives pertains to money flow more than artistry. It tends more to exploitation rather than entertainment and consequently the product is inferior and long-lived or superior with a life span that is WAY too short and that always end abruptly without a proper ending which tends to be much like getting up and leaving the table before your appetite is satisfied from a good meal.

You see example after example of this.

Today a happy medium seems to have been struck with the mini-series. Short-lived series on non-network television such as "Burn Notice", "Glades", "Sons of Anarchy" and possibly the best short-lived series ever, "Breaking Bad" are a definite lurch forward in television entertainment.

The discontinuation of popular network T.V. series such as CSI-Miami with breakthrough artful cinematography accentuates the point that NO network knows how to properly end a television series, making the exploitation of re-runs on non-network television a regular practice of network executives.

This all heralds the death of the BIG television networks when it comes to entertainment. That death will come from a terminal viewer disgust and nausea brought on by programs such as "Survivor Series", "America's Got Talent", "Dancing with the Stars" and "American Idol" that depends upon the exploitation of unknowns.

It all boils down to the fact that no-talent network executives cannot relate to anybody but to those without much taste.

[Paolo]

See the episode of "The Boondocks" called "The Hunger Strike", in which Huey goes on a hunger strike to protest BET programming.

[Paolo]

IEunuch is so right!

There was a series of books out in the early 90's called "The Nitpickers' Guides" which addressed all the things wrong with these shows, and others.

I bet the author would have a heyday with these two new Trek films.

I wonder if Okuda ever did an updated "Trek Compendium"?

[BossTamsin (imported)]

IEunuch is so right!

There was a series of books out in the early 90's called "The Nitpickers' Guides" which addressed all the things wrong with these shows, and others.

I bet the author would have a heyday with these two new Trek films.

I wonder if Okuda ever did an updated "Trek Compendium"?

You definitely don't need "The Nitpickers' Guide" so much these days. Thanks to the power of the Internet, you have a few things almost as good.

What some of us were thinking... How It Should Have Ended:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4N15J4ibej8

And two more things... 1) Seriiously, be careful when you first discover Honest Trailers and HISHE. That could easily be an evening lost. 2) Does Starfleet not teach history anymore? Khan is supposed to have ruled 1/4 of the planet, and yet they didn't recognize the name. It hasn't been that long since he was conquering. If this scruffy guy came up to you and said he was Genghis Khan, you'd know the name. Alexander the Great? Someone in the group would know the name. Napoleon? Yup, he's remembered. Yet nobody on the crew goes "hang on a mo, isn't Khan the bloodthirsty dictator that conquered this huge chunk of land a few hundred years ago?"

Sorry... I must go calm down again...