lostemnatural (imported) wrote: Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:58 am Why is it that when a man looses or has removed his balls is not considered a man but becomes a eunich, yet a woman who looses or has removed her reproductive parts is still called a woman with no discrimination?

As a woman who had a hysterectomy shortly after marrying my hubby over 20 years ago, maybe I can address that. I suppose the main reasons are that (1) there's no way for anyone to tell from external appearances, even when I'm nude, and (2) it doesn't render having sex impossible. In short, nobody knows I don't have a uterus unless I choose to tell them. I suppose the situation might be different with a woman who lost her ovaries before puberty, but that's really rare.

Sandi

lostemnatural (imported) wrote: Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:58 am Why is it that when a man looses or has removed his balls is not considered a man but becomes a eunich, yet a woman who looses or has removed her reproductive parts is still called a woman with no discrimination?

Because this is a patriarchal society. The "pinnacle" of social standing is still to be a man, and anyone who doesn't fit men's ideal of what a man is, is summarily "demoted". Women are already "beneath" men in a patriarchal society, so men don't bother to give us a different term when a cisgendered woman loses part of her reproductive parts.

C&TL2745 (imported) wrote: Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:28 am As a woman who had a hysterectomy shortly after marrying my hubby over 20 years ago, maybe I can address that. I suppose the main reasons are that (1) there's no way for anyone to tell from external appearances, even when I'm nude, and (2) it doesn't render having sex impossible. In short, nobody knows I don't have a uterus unless I choose to tell them. I suppose the situation might be different with a woman who lost her ovaries before puberty, but that's really rare.

Sandi

Even when a woman loses a breast or 2 to breast cancer, you will seldom see them labelled as "not-a-woman". The reasons are far less to do with physical appearance and function, and more to do with the bias of society. Believe you me, if this was a matriarchal society, we wouldn't care less what a man has to be considered a man either, because they're not the "pinnacle" of society anymore.

Edit: oh sorry once again i forgot I should probably use "woman" instead...

A eunuch is a castrated man, just because I'm castrated that doesn't mean I'm not a man, though I prefer to be called a eunuch. I was born a man and though physically altered, it doesn't mean I'm not a man. It's chromosomes XY, of course it could be just ones opinion too. I believe the misunderstanding is the result of the ancient or historic meaning of the word eunuch. A man who was castrated in ancient times displayed the outward and obvious results of castration. He stopped having erections, stopped thinking about sex, put on weight, slowing beard growth, etc. They were dressed as eunuchs and became feminine in many ways. Some even were penectomized and some looked penectomized simply because their penises shrank, it appears that some eunuchs were required to be nude in the presence of their masters. Once castrated, these men became servants to their masters and if their masters had harems, they often looked after the women in the harems. There is not a lot of information as to whether eunuchs serviced the harem sexually. Certainly not with intercourse.

Don 't feel bad. The guy is obviously a jerk.

C&TL2745 (imported) wrote: Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:10 am While I agree intellectually that it's what's between the ears that counts rather than what's between the legs in determining gender, still, if a "woman" comes into the ladies' room wearing jeans and a teeshirt, obviously having facial hair, a deep voice and no boobs, and "she" stands in a stall with the stall door half open to pee, I think I'd go find another restroom regardless of what "she" feels "she" is. Maybe just my personal hangup.

Sandi

That would be a very unlikely scenario. Transwomen are not hanging around women's restrooms in hopes of either catching a glimpse or letting a woman catch a glimpse of them. They are there to use the restroom. I am not sure you understand the implication of what you are saying.

I have a deep voice and sound like a man, but so does my mother in law who is continually called "sir" in person and on the phone. I also don't have "real" boobs. But what is that exactly? I mean I use breastforms, which are silicone breasts that go on the outside instead of inside. Lots of women have silicone breasts, both implanted and not implanted. Some appear not to have breasts at all. And again, not to single out my mother in law, but yes, she has facial hair too, as to many women. But still, when I use the restroom, it is the women's restroom I use.

I don't sneak around and try to peak at other women. I don't leave the door open so others can see me. And you know what? There is restroom etiquette in men's restrooms as well as women's. Men are not looking in stalls at other men, not even gay men. In fact, here in the US, men are expected to keep their head up, except to zip, and look forward. Talking is permitted as long as everyone just keeps looking forward. Just as women don't do this. Neither do transsexuals.

So if I have been driving all day, and I happen into a public restroom where you happen to be, you may be upset. I have a low voice, I would certainly have some facial hair growth noticeable at that point. And my boobs look pretty good. But I wouldn't particularly care that it upset you or any other natal female that I needed to use the restroom.

Elizabeth

....

Elizabeth (imported) wrote: Fri Feb 17, 2012 6:08 am So if I have been driving all day, and I happen into a public restroom where you happen to be, you may be upset. I have a low voice, I would certainly have some facial hair growth noticeable at that point. And my boobs look pretty good. But I wouldn't particularly care that it upset you or any other natal female that I needed to use the restroom.

Elizabeth

Thank you for the insight. I don't think I'd be upset having you in the restroom. My point was, rather, that a man who clearly looks, acts, dresses, and sounds like a man may call himself a woman, but that doesn't mean I necessarily buy it. I have empathy for transpeople, but it wasn't transpeople that I had in mind.

Sandi

The problem with this thread here is that there aren't hardly any true eunuchs.

(Actually I think that the rare 'XY' female is probably the most absolute form of eunuchism. -But it's doubtful that any of them would ever log into this site in the first place.)

'XY' CAIS female that is are the most absolute eunuch of all since these persons are actually pre-born eunuchs. Not just born-eunuchs with undescended testicles and very little masculine developement from birth but rather they are pre-born eunuchs that hadn't even begun to start any male developement whatsoever. And then there are varying degrees of 'XY' PAIS which could either be pre-born or else born eunuchs.

C&TL2745 (imported) wrote: Fri Feb 17, 2012 8:29 am Thank you for the insight. I don't think I'd be upset having you in the restroom. My point was, rather, that a man who clearly looks, acts, dresses, and sounds like a man may call himself a woman, but that doesn't mean I necessarily buy it. I have empathy for transpeople, but it wasn't transpeople that I had in mind.

Sandi

What about a genetic female dressed, looks, acts and sounds like a guy in the restroom? What if it was a cisgendered genetic female who's a drag king?