Though I see it this way

all hrt options have side effects. I'll go from highest risk assesment to lowest

Animmal Synthetic(patented) > Bio-identical synthetic(plant or annimal) > phyto estrogen

I think in my case i'll stick to the bioidentical + phyto option. I'll run the risk of being flat chested I suppose or join the itty bitty titty club.(crude joke btw inflicted on me)

I'm a tomboy anyways. So long as my face and body matches what I desire then i follow my dream.

I think breasts are a added bonus but hey......everyone's got their standards I guess.

I'm not trying to insult anyone, just I look at things with incredible analysis and detail before making choices

kristoff wrote: Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:35 pm Bottom line, if you're using herbs, you're throwing your money away. Their effect is minimal to non-existent. Go read MANY of the past posts here on topic. Save your money.

I actually agree for the most part... but as the poster wants minimal effects... specifically no breast growth... in my case at least, herbals do seem to have some of the more minor feminizing effects with little breast growth. Given a choice, I would go for doctor monitored hrt with standard medications... but I want full feminization.

trannyerica (imported) wrote: Mon Nov 12, 2012 3:57 pm I actually agree for the most part... but as the poster wants minimal effects... specifically no breast growth... in my case at least, herbals do seem to have some of the more minor feminizing effects with little breast growth. Given a choice, I would go for doctor monitored hrt with standard medications... but I want full feminization.

If you would like serious information on hormones, feminization and such try

tsdoityourselfhormones@yahoogroups.com

There are alot of people there that will answer your questions and help you.

foxytaur (imported) wrote: Wed Nov 07, 2012 7:19 pm Though I see it this way

all hrt options have side effects. I'll go from highest risk assesment to lowest

Animmal Synthetic(patented) > Bio-identical synthetic(plant or annimal) > phyto estrogen

I think in my case i'll stick to the bioidentical + phyto option. I'll run the risk of being flat chested I suppose or join the itty bitty titty club.(crude joke btw inflicted on me)

I'm a tomboy anyways. So long as my face and body matches what I desire then i follow my dream.

I think breasts are a added bonus but hey......everyone's got their standards I guess.

I'm not trying to insult anyone, just I look at things with incredible analysis and detail before making choices

You have three basic products: premarin, derived from mare urine. Some consider this the most "natural" form of estrogen because it is simply extracted from natural sources without significant further chemical synthesis. This was the earliest form of medical estrogen, and was the standard for ts hormone therapy for years. Now many question the ethics of its production, but I have seen no conclusive evidence that it is more risky than other forms. Then there is Delestrogen and its generic equivalents, usually estradiol valerete in oil and oral estrogen preparations. These are created by chemical synthesis of plant based phyto-estrogens into a synthetic ester, specifically the 17-pentanoyl ester, of the natural estrogen, 17β-estradiol. These are synthetic equivalents of natural estrogens. Currently these are the most prescribed for ts therapy. Then there are herbal phyto-estrogen products which claim to have feminizing effects. These are not bio-equivalent to estrogen, and I have never seen any effect from their use that would convince me that they are any more effective than a placebo.

Transward

transward (imported) wrote: Mon Nov 12, 2012 7:57 pm You have three basic products: premarin, derived from mare urine. Some consider this the most "natural" form of estrogen because it is simply extracted from natural sources without significant further chemical synthesis. This was the earliest form of medical estrogen, and was the standard for ts hormone therapy for years. Now many question the ethics of its production, but I have seen no conclusive evidence that it is more risky than other forms. Then there is Delestrogen and its generic equivalents, usually estradiol valerete in oil and oral estrogen preparations. These are created by chemical synthesis of plant based phyto-estrogens into a synthetic ester, specifically the 17-pentanoyl ester, of the natural estrogen, 17β-estradiol. These are synthetic equivalents of natural estrogens. Currently these are the most prescribed for ts therapy. Then there are herbal phyto-estrogen products which claim to have feminizing effects. These are not bio-equivalent to estrogen, and I have never seen any effect from their use that would convince me that they are any more effective than a placebo.

Transward

Thanks for the insight transward; I guess it really all depends who made them huh?; ill definetly will be asking my therapist and doctor about what to use since they'll know my bloodwork(I''ll promise not to drive them crazy with my hyperactive behaviour) though regardless of what ill take ill take it slowly when that time comes.(first ill go on anti androgens p)

I'll be making sure to continue with my healthy diet anyways. Low glycemic anyways cause I've heard hrt has that potential effect of increasing insulin resistance. Last thing i need is to put on weight in the wrong places LMAO

Some anti-psychotics are also said to increase prolactin levels, so my sexologist prescribed me first melperone and later sulpiride. They both had zero effects on my libido and no feminization (I am seeking libido reduction).

Well, you could everything possible to feminize (GRS excepted) and then decide if you want breast reduction surgery. It is not a pick and choose buffet.

that's another thing im curious about . Libido.

I know atm the way I describe my libido is hypersexual. Though when one's depressed the cortisol levels increase causing erectile dysfunction and all sorts of wacko things to one's sexual appetite. I find it does the complete opposite to me. as a male.

The lonlinier I get, the more repressed state im in(trapped in the house with no where to go till I grad) the hornier I get. Sorta like a hunger.

Again I don't mind my penis; What I'm curious is how will estrogen affect my hunger or appetite for sex passively?Also I'm not even sure if my libido is driven by testosterone alone, most times semen can be clear yet there I am continuing obsessively despite being drained.

NB = I described my libido as hypersexual bc i can go 10-12 times daily.I eat healthy mind you but the hyperlibido(i think its called) doesnt bother me. I do find it to be an outlet to relief my stress at home.

Probaby isnt good I know but id like to know peoples perspective on this.

I do want to transition mtf. And again very comfy expressing dual gender identity.

The question is will my male side be overiden completely by my female side?.....Unlike some classical Transgenderists I don't hate my male side.

I seem to be finding not much advice on forums with regards to gender fluid and bigender folk

Though maybe I'm thinking too hard???

I know a part of me is female and male. damn if it were only possible to grab some playdough and mix everything together.

The question is is it possible to find inner balance as a single identity despite the two genders clashing at each other. I think there can be comprimise to an extent. With my female side gaining the upper hand but is it possible???

Most TG girls I speak with seek only one way and that's is either male or female. Macho or girlyy girl. This cisgender world drives me nuts sometimes!!!!

It seems like being in the middle in shades of gray is tough to talk about with anyone without causing some disputes.

I know some TG folk I speak to get offended when some girls keep their junk but why???

Well you might already know that hrt is a ymmv-thing for everyone. It even could make you more hornier but that's very rare.

Most likely your libido will become very low in the first weeks/months. Sexual thoughts might vanish from your mind completely and it will be very hard to get and maintain an erection.

I would recommend to do a trial run maybe only with antiandrogens at first for a few weeks/months if you're really struggling with this. It's possible you might loose your motivation completely or you might feel addicted to the E - everything is possible.

The only danger I see is if you're not healthy or irreversible changes like enlarged nipples or breasts buds, reduced libido, potence or infertility although that's very rare after just a few weeks/months on low dosage hrt.

You might want to make a thread here if you want to get a few first hand reports (I think I made one here too):

http://boards.420chan.org/cd/

might be of interest to you too:

http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=10058