mrt (imported) wrote: Sun Jun 29, 2008 4:27 pm Once you have been using estrogens for a year or more, some effects may become irreversible even if estrogen intake is ceased. Certain chemical processes in the brain remain in a female pattern permanently, and changes in brain wave patterns have been reported. These effects may or may not be associated with emotional and personality changes. Breasts and female fat distribution may not subside after administration of estrogens, and sex drive may remain relatively low. For these reasons, it is important to be certain of your committment to feminization of your body.

I have found that this paragraph is likely true. I haven't heard that fat distrubution becomes permanent, but now I am wondering if this might explain why I have not lost subcutaneous fat even after an extended time on T - my skin remains soft and feminine. I have heard that low libido and chemical changes might be permanent (I still get teary-eyed at things I would not have pre-E). Also, perhaps the time needed for E effects to become permanent in the young (say those under 25) is shorter.

mrt (imported) wrote: Sun Jun 29, 2008 4:27 pm Some R&D for you per Google.

http://www.symposion.com/ijt/ijtvo05no03_02.htm

http://www.geocities.com/WestHollywood/ ... 07/hrt.htm

Partial quote of MrT's response follows:

mrt (imported) wrote: Sun Jun 29, 2008 4:27 pm *Note the comments on progesterone dose changes... And LOTS of additional links.

Once you have been using estrogens for a year or more, some effects may become irreversible even if estrogen intake is ceased. Certain chemical processes in the brain remain in a female pattern permanently, and changes in brain wave patterns have been reported. These effects may or may not be associated with emotional and personality changes. Breasts and female fat distribution may not subside after administration of estrogens, and sex drive may remain relatively low. For these reasons, it is important to be certain of your committment to feminization of your body.

I appreciate your posting this information MrT. This is in basic agreement with what I found over the last several months. The first link you provide was one of my sources.

A number of sources online, and my doctor, indicate that breast development will nearly entirely reverse within the first few months of estrogen administration. It seems like it doesn't take nearly as long as a year for that change to become mostly irreversible. Other changes, however, including others that are physical, emotional and mental do take longer to become permanent. Certainly one needs to be clear on the effects, and dangers, of estrogen treatment before starting HRT.

There are limits to what estrogen can do, as most of us here know. Once puberty has passed, estrogen HRT will have no effect on t

plix (imported) wrote: Sun Jun 29, 2008 4:44 pm he already completed maturation of masculine bone size, facial structure, amount of beard and so on.

I have found that this paragraph is likely true. I haven't heard that fat distrubution becomes permanent, but now I am wondering if this might explain why I have not lost subcutaneous fat even after an extended time on T - my skin remains soft and feminine. I have heard that low libido and chemical changes might be permanent (I still get teary-eyed at things I would not have pre-E). Also, p

erhaps the time needed for E effects to become permanent in the young (say those under 25) is shorter.

Hi plix,

From what I have read, estrogen does work more effectively in the young. Generally, the older you are when you start E, the less effect you will notice at least as far as things like breast development go. Of course, many older people still get satisfactory physical development. I am not sure if the same relationship holds for age and mental/emotional changes.

-Danya

Danya (imported) wrote: Sun Jun 29, 2008 5:55 pm There are limits to what estrogen can do, as most of us here know. Once puberty has passed, estrogen HRT will have no effect on t

he already completed maturation of masculine bone size, facial structure, amount of beard and so on.

That is entirely unfair. Revolting! I revolt, officially. I have the bone structure of a medium-sized horse. Totally unfair, I'm telling ya'.

plix (imported) wrote: Sun Jun 29, 2008 4:44 pm I have found that this paragraph is likely true. I haven't heard that fat distrubution becomes permanent, but now I am wondering if this might explain why I have not lost subcutaneous fat even after an extended time on T - my skin remains soft and feminine. I have heard that low libido and chemical changes might be permanent (I still get teary-eyed

Danya (imported) wrote: Sun Jun 29, 2008 5:55 pm at things I would not have pre-E). Also, perhaps the time needed for E effects to become permanent in t

he young (say those under 25) is shorter.

I thought it worth posting because I wonder if this is part of the explanation for why some people have G.I.D. in the first place. If for example a kid in the womb gets a large blast of Estrogens and "his" brain is wired for life female? It seems like an obvious reason for the condition.

And since we all are "made" inside women who are filled with lots of estrogen that leaking into the child "might" also explain why there are so many more m2f transexual people vs the f2m types? Of course there are probably many other reasons.

Plix is your "sexuality" has been wired female then maybe its just a matter of approaching it that way? Without getting too TMI or complicated the way a female person gets turned on is different from the male way correct? So for example being turned on by visual things = male. Being emotionaly involved = sex the female way? It might be worth some pondering.... And if thats your lot in life? Just think outside the box (no pun intended)

Why I am discouraged? I spent nearly $4,000 on electrolysis for my upper lip and chin areas which were treated multiple times for regrowth, inactive hairs that became active, etc. Now, some of the hair is reappearing. Obviously, those were not treated often enough or in the correct manner to destroy them. I did this for over two months sometimes at a rate of 6 - 7 hours a week.

I stopped in late May because I cannot afford to continue right now. The electrologist warned me that some hair growth would return but there are no options for me at this point. I know the job wasn't finished but I cannot spend the money on more electrolysis. That situation may change in a few months.

I felt really beautiful in late May because the partially cleared area of my face is where the densest hair growth had been. At that time, there was very little regrowth. I loved the way I looked and how my skin felt.

Into mid-June, I could go out without makeup because the hair on the rest of my face is hardly noticeable. It is mostly gray and not as dense.

Now the darker hairs on my upper lip and chin are clearly noticeable to me. The inexpensive foundation (makeup) I had been using doesn't hide this effectively, at least not to my satisfaction. I still get the idea that no one notices but I do and I hate it.

I was in tears this afternoon about this but only for a few minutes. This is just one of those difficult times and I have to deal with it and will.

Later this afternoon, I will try to find a better foundation that isn't too expensive. I knew I was running out of the cheap stuff but thought I could still use it a few more days. What's left in the container looks like a lot but really isn't. After using it today, I realized I won't have enough for tomorrow. I will not go to the office without makeup. If necessary, I will work remotely from home.

Tomorrow after work, I will stop at Merle Norman to see if they can suggest a really effective foundation that somehow manages to look natural. Earlier in the year, the woman who helped me choose new eyeglasses was giving me makeup tips. Her own makeup looked terrific. She uses Merle Norman and a 3-month supply of foundation costs her about $25.

Danya,

We love ya.

Your story is truly an inspiration.

Even the omnisicent Red Sister seems moved.

And you got her to reveal the boots under the habit.

And the rest for which she is blessed.

Here's hoping all the best.

-NeinNaziYahLittleNuts, soon to be vacationing in North Africa

Danya,

NaziNuts (imported) wrote: Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:10 pm We love ya.

Your story is truly an inspiration.

Even the omnisicent Red Sister seems moved.

And you got her to reveal the boots under the habit.

And the rest for which she is blessed.

Here's hoping all the best.

-NeinNaziYahLittleNuts, soon to be vacationing in North Africa

Hi NN,

It's good to hear from you. It is always good to hear that people care about me. Sometimes I need a reminder and your note was perfect! Thank you.

I know there are lots of people here who care. That's the main reason I post here.

Vacationing in North Africa? Sounds wonderful! Hope you have a great time.

-Danya

I am no longer discouraged because I found a multi-layer makeup 'system' that will solve my problem for now.

The only negative on this was that, for the first time since I transitioned on May 19, I went out of the house in my former male mode. I was concerned the neighbors would see me this way and wasn't happy at the thought. The reason I dressed as a man was that I did not want people to see the real me without makeup and a slight 5 o'clock shadow. I had just shaved, by the way. Total time to store and back: 25 minutes. I ditched the male outfit as soon as I got back home

I felt really phony dressed as a male and I did not interact nearly as well with people as I do as my female self. Overall, it was not a pleasant experience being away from home this way.

It was, however, a productive trip. I found makeup that sounded like it would do a good job for me. Certainly the ads made it sound that way. Of course, those did not describe transsexuals with beards. Nonetheless, what woman can resist the temptation to have softer, more glowing skin with blemishes hidden and wrinkles reduced? I know I couldn't!

To avoid a nasty surprise when I prepare for work in the morning, I tested the makeup as soon as I got home. I am very pleased with the results. The coverage is excellent and I have never looked better!

For now, I will not stop at Merle Norman (MN) for makeup advice. What I got today works very well and there is no need to spend additional money. When I start to run low on the new stuff, I'll check out what MN has to offer.

Danya,

I'm glad your spirits are up.

Don't let the BS get you down.

Thanks for always saying kind things to me too. My sense of humour, such as with my online name, is an acquired taste that many never acquire.

Your battle against the conformists takes real bravery and you will always have my sincere salute from the heart.

-NN

One bad thing happened today. I am working to start a photography side business. When I got home from work, I was taking some photos inside when I dropped the camera on the kitchen floor. I am very fortunate in that the camera does not appear to be damaged. It has a magnesium alloy body and so far it looks like it's fine. At least I can still take pictures with it!

The bad part is that an expensive lens with very good optics is now broken. This was a telephoto lens with built-in vibration reduction. That capability was useful for me because I have an inherited hand tremor. Despite that, this lens allowed me to take photos at maximum magnification without a tripod. This was very useful for outdoor work. Not always needing a tripod is handy when you risk losing the photo if you don't take the picture right away. I could easily get an in-focus, close-up photo of a bird holding the camera.

Luckily, I have another telephoto lens with the same magnification. Its optics aren't quite as good and there is no vibration reduction. It will still let me do most of what I need. I cannot afford to replace the damaged lens and I doubt it can be fixed.

I was upset about this for five minutes, tops, and I don't know if that's a good or bad thing. No, of course, I realize this is good. It is just that, even for that five minutes, I was only slightly upset. Beyond that, I don't feel at all down or depressed about the lens being ruined. Perhaps I am just out of touch with reality.

What I have got to conclude is that this is proof that the estrogen I've been on for 3 1/2 weeks is really making me calm. I was uncertain that this effect was real until this evening. So now I can report that I continue to feel happy and that this new calm feeling is genuine, too. Life really doesn't get much better, despite money problems, incomplete facial hair removal, being over 40 and so on. There are other new, good things in my life. Among these are friends on the Archive, some of whom I have met. There are many others here I may never meet but they care enough to respond to what I write. I feel really blessed.

For years, I would tell myself that certain things in life were not important, such as breaking a fairly expensive lens. I didn't always accept that on an emotional level. Now that I have found myself my emotions are much more in line with my understanding of what matters.

This evening I have learned that I need to slow down some. It don't feel rushed but I am trying to get a lot done and I am excited about what I am doing. You won't find me sitting around wondering what to do next. I am in no way bored. I need be more mindful, though, of what I am doing. This is the first time I have dropped a camera and I don't want that to happen again.