It might have done nothing and to inject that stuff again might be too painful and could backfire on you.

No shrinkage argh!!!! Forget this stuff.

Whether this stuff works or not, the pain may not be worth it.

knightbird111 (imported) wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2012 7:51 am It might have done nothing and to inject that stuff again might be too painful and could backfire on you.

No shrinkage argh!!!! Forget this stuff.

Whether this stuff works or not, the pain may not be worth it.

It's only been a few days... apparently this takes weeks? Also, too painful for people like me maybe... but I'm not exactly used to pain. My 9/10 could be another persons 0.1/10! I also said they're almost back to their normal size, meaning they're still a little swollen.

After viewing the video on how the calcium injections are done to stray animals in India, it seems one would want to duplicate or obtain the solution from the company that produces it. it seems they use calcium chloride in a sodium chloride (salt) solution witha pain killer. The sodium chloride solution does not cause any pain since the body is composed of so much of it. The pain killer just numbs the testis a bit. The animals do not seem to have much discomfort and are up and running after a few minutes. I suspect the calcium chloride remains in the tissue of the testis and as mentioned by others prevents cell regeneration. it seem like the calcium chloride injections is easier to take, only one is needed and it does destroy the testis. The problem seems to be obtaining the actual solution and determining the proper dosage for an adult males testis.

knightbird111 (imported) wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2012 7:51 am It might have done nothing and to inject that stuff again might be too painful and could backfire on you.

No shrinkage argh!!!! Forget this stuff.

Whether this stuff works or not, the pain may not be worth it.

Everyone in the modern world is really impatient. This is definitely a slow process. In fact, the slow progression is one of the reasons I feel this is a good method -- not an act of acute damage but rather a definitive process of the body shutting it down.

Check of this description of the timeframe her

SplitDik (imported) wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2012 3:28 pm e: http:

SplitDik (imported) wrote: Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:21 pm //www.stray-afp.org/nl/wp-content/uploads/2012

/09/CaCl-1978-Koger-ModVetPractice-report.pdf

Within seconds after the injection, the testicles become very firm to the palpation, and of much greater turgidity than can be ascribed to the volume induced. Most animals walk with a stilted gait in the hindquarters for 24-48 hours. Swelling and progressive induration [hardening] persist for 4-5 days. Atrophy is apparent after 2 to 3 weeks, and after 3 months only a small testicle remnant can be palpated.

Whatever you do, don't get impatient and do something like inject again or inject something else. From your description so far, you're right on schedule.

There is a new study going on in Italy.

SplitDik (imported) wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2012 3:28 pm http://www.stray-afp.org/nl/wp-content/uploads/2012

/09/CaCl-BIBLIOGRAPHY-READING-LIST1.pdf

Early results indicate:

Leoci, 2012/2013 (Italy):

- dose-finding study, calcium chloride in saline, 40 dogs

- 20% calcium chloride in alcohol, 21 dogs

- 20% calcium chloride in lidocaine, 21 dogs

Concludes that alcohol and lidocaine bases are more effective than saline (some dogs in lower

doses in the saline group regain some sperm production after 6 months, and some dogs in the

higher doses in the saline group have abscesses, while the alcohol and lidocaine groups have effect

without complications). Concludes that one of the two bases (alcohol or lidocaine) is the fastestacting. Saline and alcohol groups 1-year study completed as of 9/2012; lidocaine group in process.

SplitDik (imported) wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2012 10:43 am There is a new study going on in Italy.

SplitDik (imported) wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2012 3:28 pm http:

SplitDik (imported) wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2012 10:43 am //www.stray-afp.org/nl/wp-content/upload

s/2012

/09/CaCl-BIBLIOGRAPHY-READING-LIST1.pdf

That's one I did not have. Thanks.

This is from the Parsemus Foundation. I can't find links in their site for the Kroger reports.

I'd especially like to see the one on Rams for intrepididymal injections (no web presence for that yet - trip to Library, I guess).

If I were to do this, it would be a licodaine mix. I'm highly alergic to alcohol.

From w

nullorchis (imported) wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2012 5:22 am hat I have seen, 20mg per testicle should do the deed.

In addition to the main objective of reducing testosterone there are Considerations of possible side effects :

infection,

epididymitis

granuloma

vas deferens abscess,

vesicular gland abscess,

vasovenous fistula,

testicular necrosis leading to gangrene,

arteriovenous fistula,

pulmonary embolism,

endocarditis,

scrotal ski

n necrosis

Fournier's disease

hydrocel

.............

nullorchis, I'm satisfied that the developers of this method are legitimate - with animals; especially the strays in India. I have not seen any literature that suggests the list of possible side effects you state - as from the use of Calcium Chloride injections. Where did you get the info? Can you provide a link? If you have knowledge of the procedure, or found evidence of side effects, please post the links, so others can see. This is a learning process that all want to share.

I can concur with the conspiracy notion though, as I have worked in the medical field, and lived with a doctor. I also have a cousin who is a gastroenterologist. I can tell you, it is $ that makes their world-go-round. And, they do hide undesirable results in Parma-studies.

The group sponsoring these trials is in desperate need of a real solution to a MAJOR problem of an over-population of dogs and cats. They are not a slaughtering-group; although I don't see the need to allow unwanted dogs left to roam.

But . . . I'm a country boy, used to eating meat, and knowing when it's time to do away with an animal. City folks don't actually deal with where meat comes from. And, they don't like to face their failings, like allowing their pets to go natural, and not being responsible for them.

I live in N. GA (USA), and we have a severe problem with unwanted dogs and cats. We also have a mild coyote problem too. The wild dogs and coyotes cross breed, creating an even bigger problem.

These trials with Calcium Chloride would be very beneficial for this type of problem.

Trouble is . .. here in the USA, Veterinarians are as accustomed to $ as the human physicians. I seriously doubt they would allow a simple solution to go un-noticed. They make a lot of $ on spay-N-neuter surgery programs. Why give up something that takes about 30 minutes and earns upwards of $100+, for a simple 5-minute quick-fix, catch and release solution that only costs a couple of dollars; or if done ‘in house’ couldn’t fetch more than $20? (BTW; this solution first came in use about [?] 15 years ago. Wonder if the US Veterinary Association halted it's progress?)

Back on subject . . . I’m really looking forward to each new finding. I think it holds a lot of promise for all males in need of neutering.

From what I have seen, 20cc per testicle should do the deed.

Are you sure? 20cc sounds like a lot.

Are you sure? 20cc sounds like a lot.

I should have put mg. I'm too used to dosing horses. I'll edit post. Thanks for catching that.

SplitDik (imported) wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:14 pm http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15721661

20-40 mg per testicle was the study in goats.

Not sure where I found potential negative issues regarding any injection into a testicle,

It was somewhere in here:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=c ... 0injection% 20side%20effects

In this article:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3152893/

Just above the conclusion is this statement:

Due to its permanent reduction of testosterone, calcium chloride would be used in cases where elimination or reduction of sex-based behavior is desired, such as for family pets and in control cat programs. The primary practical advantages of calcium chloride over surgery are affordability, elimination of the need for anesthesia, sterile conditions, and recovery care. It is easy to inject since unlike previous attempts at sterilizing agents, it is not rapidly caustic to the skin; little training is required and complications are avoided if any spilled solution is wiped away. The primary disadvantage is slow onset of action (4-6 weeks) and the level of discomfort during injection, which we hope to address by calibrating injection volume more specifically in near future.

I'm not sure if it's just because of how swollen they were, or if it's something happening, but they appear smaller than before I did the injections now. Not much smaller, but smaller.