RJLupin (imported) wrote: Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:26 pm I agree. Even after orchiectomy AND estrogen treatment, I don't feel any "calmer" than before. If anything, I feel more stressed out from the hot flashes and fatigue I now experience. If you do a Google search for "low testosterone" you'll not find "calm" listed, you'll read about all kinds of horrible things like "apathy" and "weight gain" and "cognitive impairment."

I don't regret my orchiectomy surgery, because it was done as part of a gender reassignment process. However, anyone who thinks it will be either some huge erotic thrill, or will make them "calm" after surgery, is deluding themselves and headed for disaster.

Firstly, you are on estrogen, wich is known to offset the effects of orchiectomy by and large. Additionally, estrogen has a powerful effect on the male pituitary wich definitely reinforces most of symptoms of menopause if you quit the regimen abrubtly vs. if you never started it in the first place. I know of a 58 year old female who have major difficulties of quitting her HRT regimen, for exactly the same reasons, and her symptoms are far worse than they were at the time of menopause, if she skips over just a few doses (the higher the dose, the most difficult it is to withdraw). I would think this to be a very common side effect, as also seen in the bodybuilders (who consider even the so-called normal male range as "too low" after periods of steroid abuse). Furthermore, your experience flies in the face of so many people who reported significantly less aggression after testosterone reduction, here on EA and elsewhere. F. inst. one of the most extensive personal homepages about castration on the internet, that of Sherry Lanina, deals in great detail about the castration-related serenity, as can be read here: http://www.geocities.com/sherrylanina/C ... fects.html

As to the Google search results for "low testosterone": frankly, most of the "terrible consequences" you can read about on the first pages, and all those "sponsored links" to the right, are in some 90% of cases a result of active marketing tricks selling androgen supplements for men who are hungry for more sex and boosted masculine appeal in our exceedingly sex-crazed world (Of course, virtually all of the men who apply for these supplements have absolutely no interest in castration). These sites are constantly pushing all of the pro-androgen publications and advertizing up the Google ranks so it`s not the least surprising that such results are popping up. However, if you search further you might get far more balanced results.

Finally, I do not consider the so-called naturally occuring low testosterone levels (wich in many cases is about a level of between 200 - 400 ng\dl) as a fair example of some of the castration effects, including the "eunuch calm", etc, mostly due to the reasons above, but also because in most cases these men continue to be under still significant androgenic influence (baldness, prostate enlargement, etc, wich is documented to continue even at levels below 300).

kristoff wrote: Fri Dec 15, 2006 10:33 pm I would agree that this may be largely, if not wholly, a matter of definition. On the other hand, I give utterly NO credence to anything that Spector would say on the subject. My experience and knowledge of his history, dating to the early 1950s, suggest that he is solely self-serving and greedy. He merely found a niche to market to, and marketed it well. He made a lot of money, and practiced beyond his time. While he was *able* he provided a needed service, and deserved to earn his compensation, but he was as much a marketeer as the cereal and candy makers are.

Thanks for your reply. I understand that your experience with Spector was overtly negative; and I completely agree that he should not have practiced at all once the senility and his tremor set in. He had likely butched many more surgeries in his later years. However, despite some of his flaws, I also had a feeling that he was an honest man who sincerely wanted to help (even if he was too quick to accept castrations because of need of cash; however, Kimmel would not be particularly different in this regard either - everyone have to drive their niche, regardless). Spector has also performed many successful castrations - literary thousands of them - during the course of his career (he was pretty much considered a pioneer in the field). Some of his very recent happy patients, that I know of, include Andrew, Sherry and Jeff. However, one major reason why I prefer to "examine the message, not the messenger" in his case, is simply because I have experienced the serenity effects he wrote about, first hand, and that before I ever came to read about "eunuch calm" in any detail. I submit that his extensive experience with castration and his patients deserves a more honest approach, instead of simply dismissing everything he has to say merely due to his personal flaws.

Uncle Flo (imported) wrote: Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:03 pm I would like to suggest that the effect known as "eunuch calm" may, in fact, simply be the reaction that someone has after reaching a long sought goal(ie castration). Much like the feeling of overall relief ( may I even say calm?) experienced when one finishes a long, difficult task successfuly. --FLO--

Exactly. Total satisfaction. A lack of frustration.

Eunuchist (imported) wrote: Sat Dec 16, 2006 2:57 pm Firstly, you are on estrogen, wich is known to offset the effects of orchiectomy by and large. Additionally, estrogen has a powerful effect on the male pituitary wich definitely reinforces most of symptoms of menopause if you quit the regimen abrubtly vs. if you never started it in the first place. I know of a 58 year old female who have major difficulties of quitting her HRT regimen, for exactly the same reasons, and her symptoms are far worse than they were at the time of menopause, if she skips over just a few doses (the higher the dose, the most difficult it is to withdraw). I would think this to be a very common side effect, as also seen in the bodybuilders (who consider even the so-called normal male range as "too low" after periods of steroid abuse). Furthermore, your experience flies in the face of so many people who reported significantly less aggression after testosterone reduction, here on EA and elsewhere. F. inst. one of the most extensive personal homepages about castration on the internet, that of Sherry Lanina, deals in great detail about the castration-related serenity, as can be read here: http://www.geocities.com/sherrylanina/C ... fects.html

As to the Google search results for "low testosterone": frankly, most of the "terrible consequences" you can read about on the first pages, and all those "sponsored links" to the right, are in some 90% of cases a result of active marketing tricks selling androgen supplements for men who are hungry for more sex and boosted masculine appeal in our exceedingly sex-crazed world (Of course, virtually all of the men who apply for these supplements have absolutely no interest in castration). These sites are constantly pushing all of the pro-androgen publications and advertizing up the Google ranks so it`s not the least surprising that such results are popping up. However, if you search further you might get far more balanced results.

Finally, I do not consider the so-called naturally occuring low testosterone levels (wich in many cases is about a level of between 200 - 400 ng\dl) as a fair example of some of the castration effects, including the "eunuch calm", etc, mostly due to the reasons above, but also because in most cases these men continue to be under still significant androgenic influence (baldness, prostate enlargement, etc, wich is documented to continue even at levels below 300).

I had my orchiectomy before I started estrogen, so I do indeed know what the effects of low testosterone are. Maybe some people don't have them; I did. It was very unpleasant. Hot flashes, night sweats, trouble sleeping, depression. The estrogen I now take made all this go away, but if I decided I didn't want to take HRT I would be in trouble. I remain very concerned about anyone who thinks life will be peachy after an orchiectomy and no hormone, because it's not. Just my experience.

Hi All,

It's been tough the past 7 days or so. I've been pretty sick. I had my teeth worked on a week ago this past Monday and in the process picked up a very nasty infection in my gums, so bad, that I was running a fever of almost 101° for a period of about 36 hours. I also had some pretty sever swelling in my face and jaw areas. Couldn't even eat anything for almost 2 days. I've been on antibiotics for over a week now and have finally gotten this infection under control. Thank God! One heck of a diet, eh?

This Holiday season has also been hard. It's going to be a very quite and somewhat depressing Christmas this year, but what are you going to do when your family wants nothing to do with you? I hope that it will get easier after the first Christmas without them. The first time is always the hardest!

I'm going to invite some of my TG/sisters to spend Christmas with me at my home this year. It seems like a lot of us TG/girls suffer from the lack of family so I don't feel like I've been singled out, just one of "the girls" I guess.

I sincerely hope that everyone's Holiday season has been a good one or at least better than mine, which should be pretty easy to do, unless you've been hit by a car or something.

Erica Ann I am your friend too. I hope you are doing ok

Erica Ann,

Hey write to me anytime. I have been away from family.. overseas, not alienated.. for many holidays.. but your situation will get bettter.. trust me it will..

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for the kind thoughts. I'm doing okay, it's just a little bit rough right now, but what the hell, like I said before, a lot of us TG/girls have a hard time around this time of year. That's pretty evident by reading some of the post from another web site I belong to, so I guess I really am "one of the girls". Sometimes the membership dues to these "exclusive clubs" can be quite pricey.

Anyways, I sincerely wish all of all a very Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays, which ever applies, and may the upcoming New Year hold new promise for better days!

Hi Everyone,

Made a very bold decision last night and I'm following through with it. It's a slow week at work this week. The president of the company as well as the marketing director are both off on vacation this week and out of the country...so I decided to try full time transition for the next five days. WOW, 24/7 for the next few days.

I came to work this morning, for the very first time, as myself...a female and as I sit here at my desk writing this post, I feel absolutely wonderful. It is an experience beyond belief and while I was a bit apprehensive about it this morning while I was getting dressed, everything has worked out so far.

Just being ones self is such a great experience and this is a wonderfully little experiment for me.

I'll keep you posted as to how it's going, but so far so good.

My fingers are crossed and I'm holding my breath for you. --FLO--