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CastraCare (imported) wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2015 3:18 pm Has anybody come back from gay to straight?

My partner is absolutely convinced that one is born gay, Bi or straight.

He often says that he would like to talk to someone who claimed becoming straight after being gay. He will interrogate that person with questions like:

"Now that you claim to be straight,

1) do you desire woman now instead of men;

2) did your character change from being feminine like to butch;

3) do you suppress gay thoughts or is your though-life at peace with your new-found sexual identity; and

4) you are absolutely, definitively straight in your whole being?"

My partner has tried everything possible to be straight both clinically and spiritually, but he wants to be "cured" fully...NOT faking it by supressing his sexual orientation. So he has now at age 58 accepted that there is nothing he can do (short from a miracle from God) to change his sexual identity and that one is born that way.

After 10 years of self research regarding human sexuality, I have also come to the conclusion that there is a sexuality scale - straight (Very Butch) being on the left-most and Gay (extreme femininity) on the right and Bi-sexual in the middle (I'm oversimplifying). I am not totally on the left (not butch), but a bit more to the right...still straight but not feminine. I believe that people are born somewhere on this scale and it cannot be changed. If a man claim to be straight and then have sex with another man, then I'm of the opinion he was never really straight but more Bi. As for me, my brothers and brother in law...we can never have sexual relations with another man even if we are paid to do it because we don't fall in the Bi-sexual range of the scale.

As I said, this is MY conclusions and I'm sure there are more qualified people here that can explain things better.

So to answer your question...according to my partner "NO!" one cannot change his sexual orientation.

YodaNell (imported) wrote: Sat Sep 12, 2015 1:52 am 2) did your character change from being feminine like to butch;

This is irrelevant. You are mixing gender presentation with sexual attraction. They are separate.

YodaNell (imported) wrote: Sat Sep 12, 2015 1:52 am After 10 years of self research regarding human sexuality, I have also come to the conclusion that there is a sexuality scale - straight (Very Butch) being on the left-most and Gay (extreme femininity) on the right and Bi-sexual in the middle

You probably should do another 10 years of research because there are shitload of gay guys that are more butch (and more redneck) than most straight guys. I guess you never did any research in a gay leather club or at a gay bear club.

YodaNell (imported) wrote: Sat Sep 12, 2015 1:52 am After 10 years of self research regarding human sexuality, I have also come to the conclusion that there is a sexuality scale - straight (Very Butch) being on the left-most and Gay (extreme femininity) on the right and Bi-sexual in the middle (I'm oversimplifying). I am not totally on the left (not butch), but a bit more to the right...still straight but not feminine. I believe that people are born somewhere on this scale and it cannot be changed. If a man claim to be straight and then have sex with another man, then I'm of the opinion he was never really straight but more Bi. As for me, my brothers and brother in law...we can never have sexual relations with another man even if we are paid to do it because we don't fall in the Bi-sexual range of the scale.

As I said, this is MY conclusions and I'm sure there are more qualified people here that can explain things better.

So to answer your question...according to my partner "NO!" one cannot change his sexual orientation.

Sexual orientation and masculinity-femininity are two different matters. There are many gay men who are very masculine.

During my musical career, I have seen probably more that 100 gay men. Orchestras and wind bands (like military and concert bands) have many gay musicians. You know, in all honesty, I cannot recall one masculine person among them. They all have feminine traits in the way they walk, talk...their whole being. Some have more of those traits; some have less. So far, interacting with those men, one can definitely tell if that person is straight or gay...masculine or feminine. These guys, like my partner, do not show masculine interests. My partner, for example, constantly thinks about the colour of curtains, cups and saucers...basically, when I observe him/them, I see a person/soul/being/mind set, as that of a woman. I have not seen one of those guys that act like men in the way they walk, talk, etc. Many years ago, I have been inside a guy club, only once. I was invited by some of my fellow bandsman. I tell you the truth, I cannot recall what the people did or how they acted in the club. It was many (20+) years ago, and like I've mentioned before, I was ignorant in these matters. But I do recall how my buddies acted. There were about 12 of us and they all acted like woman. One even came in with a handbag swinging on his arm.

So, like I admitted above, it is my observations/perspective and I'm not an expert in this field. Yes, we can start playing with words, and you might be correct as well (please remember I'm not English but Afrikaans), and as it happens in other non-English languages, one might not always express using the correct words, but surely the message should come across. As I (and all my friends and family) see "Butch", we think of highly manly/masculine in the whole being. When my partner told me he wanted relations with a butch man, he (also Afrikaans) was referring to a man without any feminine traits, a masculine straight and hairy man who walk and talk like a man; so butch as in non-gay. I'm sure you guys must understand what I'm trying to say.

This debate, however, is not the point of this thread. My gay (feminine acting/walking/talking) partner absolutely believe that a gay person cannot become straight. This is the point, and during my 10 year (self study/investigation/observations/research) I have not met any person who has (or were able) to change his orientation. I know lots of Christian gay men here in Cape Town who struggles with this. They want to be straight (Religious guilt, I guess), and they pray and even suppress their gayness (if there's such a word), but are not able to do it. So the willingness to change is there, but the "programming" is written in the being, and cannot change. So far...

But this is my perspective, and I'll be honoured if you would respect my perspective (right or wrong) the same as I respect your perspective (right or wrong) as well. Human sexuality is incredibly broad and I don't think anyone of us knows exactly the way things are...even the experts debate among themselves regarding these matters.

I think that one should examine oneself and know who you are, and accept it. Only God can change the "programming"...what we call a miracle...and I am eagerly searching to find and talk to that person who's orientation has changed.

Enjoy your weekend!!