kristoff wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2010 9:49 am There will be no such manual posted here, ever. We do not accept liability for people doing stupid things, and we will not facilitate those stupid things.

So there you go! One has to defer to Mother Superior!

There is a lot of help and advice for those who want to take drugs for chemical castration, in spite of all the associated health risks and even death associated with thrombosis, heart failure, Liver failure etc, just a bit less bloody, I guess.

What is the difference between a pill and a scalpel if the outcome is the same? Both have Very High Risks associated with them. The only difference is that the pill path is less in your face, and a heart attack is just another patient in the morgue rather than an a blood filled sack in the reception area.

I can appreciate the liability issue. There is of course more stigma attached to a bloody mess than a purple haze. But in essence the two are the same.

The determined will just go on anyway. Just do a search for 'DIY Castration', there are quite a few in England! Maybe we have more balls than the rest of the world!

However, I don't think stupid is the right word Kristoff, desperate but not stupid. If desperate people had more information,they would make better choices, instead of going up to the bathroom and hacking their nuts off!

If they had the right information and continued to hack them off over the germ infested toilet, then that is stupid.

This is a very real issue and food for thought, it will not go away.

The good news is that if you Google enough you can find out exactly how you should go about it, with minimal risk.

Because the risk is so high, research compels me to create a knowledgebase to make an informed decision. I may or may not go through with it. But I will be confident that I can do it if I want to.

So in conclusion, don't just hack them off and keep a pile of books ready for the hospital stay, research like any other proposition and then do the job properly.

This is a really great place to discuss all these issues and there is a huge amount of heart and compassion here from some really great people. That does not mean I have to agree with them.

J

no one is saying that this forum should facillitate for the daft,but wouldit not be better to have some sort of how to do it safe,rather than we read aother story of some deperate erson bleeding to death.

I do see where kristof is coming from in what he says,but i do belive that it is better to know how to do it without the risk of death,rather than someone just cuts off there sac and nuts,and needs urgent medical help or death.

And as i have said in other posts it is better to get castrated by a doctor and in a hospital setting,but there are those who through mental health,or for that matter reassons of desperations, will no doubt take the step of self castration,so wouldit not be attering for the daft.

But infact looking after those who will go down that road,and make sure that they do it ina safe manner.

Exactly, Chemcast, That is the debate here.

Order of surgical castration methods, ranked in order of likely success without complications:

1. Hospital

2. Clinic

3. Some sort of cutter with any sort of medical experience

4. Some sort of cutter without any medical experience

5. Yourself.

Notice which one is last on this list.

--LT

Please don't go the DIY castration route with a knife.

Here are at least two reasons why a) you can end up in court and b) you can die. Neither is a good outcome. Notice I didn't include emergency room because I know almost for certain that you will end up there. Either from pain, bleeding or infection.

Please don't go the DIY cut and chop route.

Man Found Guilty of Injuring Woman During Castration

Milkman (imported) wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2010 3:56 am http://www.eunuch.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=5607

and

http://www.eunuch.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=

5600&highlight=lenhart

Facing Life in Wrong Body Leads To Botched Castration

Milkman (imported) wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2010 3:56 am http://www.eunuch.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=

4120

And this external story:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04335/419238.stm

Discussed here:

Milkman (imported) wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2010 3:56 am http://www.eunuch.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=

6483&highlight=lenhart

A second case at these links:

http://www.wpxi.com/news/2498071/detail.html

The Tammy Feldbaum case where a person died:

http://www.post-gazette.com/regionstate ... tommy6.asp

Milkman (imported) wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2010 3:56 am http://www.eunuch.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=

203&highlight=Feldbaum

Dave,

You have raised a number of points.

I am in the UK and the law may be different here. It is not a criminal offence to self mutilate or perform any surgery on yourself.

I have no doubt that to do it to others is a criminal offence. I am not planning on doing it to anyone else! That is not what this thread is about.

The cases you quote are all someone (bogus) doing it to someone else.

In all honesty I would rather take the risk of doing it myself than to trust some 'underground cutter or doctor'. You need to be absolutely sure of someone else performing this sort of surgery and I don't think it would be easy to 'find' a trust worthy cutter.

I do have some medical experience, not a lot but enough to stich myself up and keep the infection under control.

I circumcised myself years ago and I was all healed up within 3 weeks with no adverse effects.

What we are taliking about here are people who have no option of going to a doctor or legitimate treatment centre and getting surgery.

For me the only option would be Thailand or India and I don't have much confidence in those places. There are some horror stories of infection etc.

Secondly the costs of going there is too high.

We are talking about people who have no where else to go formany reasons.

There are thousands of people male and female who perform all sorts of surgery on themselves and others body modification and more importantly genital mods are all over the place.

bmezine.com for example is a wealth of information on all sorts of 'surgery'.

Surgery is technique and infection control.

Yes but would itnot be better for those who will do it themselfs, to do it in a safe manner rather than take the chance of doing something totaly wrong,nd end up bleeding to death or needing urgent emergancy treatment.

I totaly believe that the best way to get castrated is by a doctor i a hospital setting,but as we all know there will always be those who will go the diy roue,would it not be better for the correct advice be made availble to them.

And for that reason i truly do think that the rght sort of advice shuld be there,we might not agree with it but that dose not mean that some sort of advice should not be made for those who are determind to go that route.

well said jcat we are not saying there should be a diy guide to elf castration, but should there be some sort of advice on how to be safe if you are going to do it. better to be safe than sorry as they say.

i would feel better if someone did it in a safe manner themselfs than take a risk of bleeding out by doing it wrong. and there is no way i would trust any cutter or let someone i do not know do that to me, as you say you are better to do t yourself than risk anything like that.

I have been thinking about EA's law that no manual on self castration will ever be available.

On the other hand there is a huge wealth ofinforamtion published here on the self administration of drugs.

There are numerous posts by individuals who have done a DIY job and survived.

Do we berate them for being stupid to hack their nuts off over the bath or even worse over the toilet and not even bothering to tie the cords off properly. But why bother? They have already prepared a pile of books to read in hospital! Why? because they knew it was going to fail and end in hospital.

Did it deter them? No Why? Beciase the hospital was in the plan!

What we actually do is to congratulate them for surviving and welcome them aboard the good ship Eunuch. At he same time allthe detail of their mistakes are published for others to read and learn from.

To the desperate mind reading a botched DIY job does not deter them from taking such enormous risk. It reassures them thatthey can do the same and get their hearts desire and so they too hack the nuts off and leave trail of blood to the hospital to clean up.

To them the good news is that they will end up free of the nuts that haunt them and that is a risk worth taking.

So little wonder we applaud them for surviving and let's face it wehave not got the same courage they have and so we secretly admire them.

In my world freedom of information is about laying it all out and letting people make informed decisions.

If the right information was out thereit would save lives and a lot of pain.

It is in my mind horribly inconsistent not to address this.

Dave,

...

jcat (imported) wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2010 2:23 pm The cases you quote are all someone (bogus) doing it to someone else.

...

I can assure you that neither of those cases were by people who wanted to do harm or were inexperienced. Read the articles.

In one case, it was a self-surgery gone wrong (Feldbaum). the pain and blood loss got too much and then the other person had to step in and try to fix things.

In the other case, the experienced cutter knew he was in trouble and called the ambulance. He faced a judge and explained everything he did. The judge was sympathetic but had to find the man guilty.

My point is to be careful and plan for everything that could go wrong. And then plan for eveyrthing else to go wrong.

Most of the people here have heard my lectures on safety. I worked with high pressure and poisonous gases in my career and we planned safety into everything we touched. I might sound over-cautious but you only have one life. Safety first.