What Happened to the Devil?

[Riverwind (imported)]

If you believe in the devil then it stands to reason that you must believe in hell, I don't.

And if you don't believe in the devil or hell then the next step is to not believe in haven which I don't either.

So if you don't believe in hell the devil or haven then it stands to reason that you don't believe in God.

No I do not believe in one god.

There is no proof that god, heaven, hell, or the devil exist, none. Its all man made, made so man would be able to tell you where and why he is here, it is called mytholigy, it comes in a lot of forms, Egyptian, Roman, Greek, Genesis, Norse, Native American and even a tribe in south america that runs around naked and all can tell you where we came from why were here, good, evil, the whole thing.

Today we don't need that as we have evolved in our education, science, etc. we have outgrown it, well some of us have.

River

[Misha999 (imported)]

I believe our dilemma lies in the uneasy sense that we are unsure if we are created or if we've created ourselves. It's this lack of security that perplexes us most. We're certain that we know something, but what? That's the question.

M

The thing that separates man from the animals lies not in the fact that he knows. It's that he knows he knows. ~Morris West Shoes of the Fisherman

[Old Greebo (imported)]

<<

No I do not believe in one god.

>> [Riverwind]

So which one don't you believe in?

Oh, OK, sorry, that's trite.

But you are implying either that you *do* believe in more than one god, or that there is only one god that you don't believe in.

Or that you believe in less than one god.

Want to say more?

Me, I'll take the philosophers' cop-out and just say "It depends what you mean by god".

[moi621 (imported)]

Satan's greatest advantage nowadays is few believe the Dark Lord is real.

Unfettered with serious opposition from man Evil runs rampant.

M

YES !

Whether a Dark Lord or dark spirits, they are rarely referred to in the 21st Century.

How can an individual or society that does not recognize evil / wrong / bad sustain - goodness? Everything has become, okay, if you can get away with it.

If one is an absolute atheist, then I respect their ability to identify good from evil more then a believer who denies the difference exists in our daily lives by our every action, because evil - The Devil does not exist.

Believing in the Devil, is not Devil worship. It is an acknowledgement.

The moral lapses we see today in petty, major or unbelievable crimes seems like a recurrent theme in history - all because of a lack of morality.

Enron, AIG, where not the work of one individual. It took lots of cooperation.

So what is the truth of it?

rambling Moi

[Riverwind (imported)]

<< [quote="Riverwind (imported)" t

ime=1258776060]
No I do not believe in one god.

>> [Riverwind]

So which one don't you believe in?

Oh, OK, sorry, that's trite.

But you are implying either that you *do* believe in more than one god, or that there is only one god that you don't believe in.

Or that you believe in less than one god.

Want to say more?

Me, I'll take the philosophers
[/quote]
' cop-out and just say "It depends what you mean by god".

LOL, I wondered if that would get a comment.

Actually, if there is a god or gods, they are totally unknown to me. But if there were a god or gods I would think that they are like mother earth or father sky, uncle Mars, or. well you get the idea. However I have seen the results of god if there is one, go outside on a clear night when your away from city lights, look up, only then does the meaning of life become apparent and your reminded not to take yourself to serious.

River

[IbPervert (imported)]

And if you don't believe in the devil or hell then the next step is to not believe in haven which I don't either.

So if you don't believe in hell the devil or haven then it stands to reason that you don't believe in God.

No I do not believe in one god.

River

I don't believe in Hell, but I do believe in God. From our limited perspective you cant have one with out the other, but what if we could shift our view points and look from a different direction or angle.

[gareth19 (imported)]

In the foreword to The Screwtape Letters, C.S. Lewis wrote that the most common question he was asked was whether he "believed in the Devil," and his reply was that he didn't though he believed in devils. His point was that "the Devil" as an anti-god, a being of pure "evil" and the opposite of God, a being of pure good, was an impossibility, so perhaps your Christian neighbors are a bit more sophisticated theologically speaking and are adhering to the traditional Christian view rather than a kind of Manichaeanism which sets up two principles, one of Good and the other of Evil. The problem with an ontological dualism, seen as long ago as the 5th century, is that such a system allows for no judgment that Principle A is good or Principle B is evil, they are just different, and that's all. Such a view leaves no basis for actually deciding that telling lies is bad or feeding the poor is good; you could as easily switch the labels, register as a Republican, and have the smug satisfaction that spreading rumors that Obama's birth certificate is invalid or cutting off food programs to preschoolers and declaring catsup a vegetable are virtuous acts.

This fact probably explains why so many of the doubly misnamed "Moral Majority" talk about Satan far more often that about Jesus, and certainly never in a way which reflects His actual teachings. People like Pat Robertson or Jimmy Swaggert have no use for the Jesus who defended the adultress against the stoning mob or the parable of the mote in the eye, for their entire lives are devoted to the things He rejected, judging others and looking for the weaknesses of others while blatantly ignoring one's own failings.

[moi621 (imported)]

When some say, "they do not believe",

please identify what you don't believe in.

God of the Bible?

Any ethereal or spiritual realm?

I was an atheist comfortable with science uber alles

and view my episodes as coincidences, & no biggie.

Then came the, Wham-Bang-Pow experience.

No coincidence. My beliefs shaken to the core.

Are there those here who believe in God but not the Devil?

Are there those here who believe there is a spiritual realm

with good, neutral and evil influences?

Above all, please, if you say you do not believe, spell out what

you do not believe in.

[Riverwind (imported)]

When some say, "they do not believe",

please identify what you don't believe in.

God of the Bible?

Any ethereal or spiritual realm?

I was an atheist comfortable with science uber alles

and view my episodes as coincidences, & no biggie.

Then came the, Wham-Bang-Pow experience.

No coincidence. My beliefs shaken to the core.

Are there those here who believe in God but not the Devil?

Are there those here who believe there is a spiritual realm

with good, neutral and evil influences?

Above all, please, if you say you do not believe, spell out what

you do not believe in.

The term GOD a superior being that created the universe, an all knowing and all seeing personage, etc. I don't believe that.

The term GOD of the BIBLE, the heavenly father, I have 5 kids, when they got into a fight and they did I would stop it and give them a time out, sometimes for a week or two, if the Jews are GOD's chosen people like the BIBLE says, then that GOD does not exist because any father would step in if someone was mass murdering his children, so much for heavenly father, unless of course he is dead, which is a possibility I had not considered but if he is dead then who cares?

SO,

I do not believe in a being created by man in his own image that sits on high and will judge me when he is guilty of so much more than I could possibly be guilty of, ever, for one thing I have only been able to do bad things for about 63 years, he has had billions of years, or if you are a creationist 6000 years, Tuesday, 10:00 AM Eastern Time Zone.

Heaven, oh we have been good and GOD has created a House for you, its made of gold, has a 1000 rooms, you will have riches and joys beyond your wildest dreams. So if this is true, who does the cleaning and cooking? or doesn't anybody take a shit in heaven?

If GOD is man made which seams to be the case as there is not scientific evidence that a GOD has ever existed. Then it stands to reason that there is no heaven, and the next step is to realize that there is no hell, which brings you back to your question NO there is no DEVIL.

Having said that, there should be a GOD, I for one am leaning toward Joan Rivers. Now she might not be a god to you, but to me she is someone I can see, hear, touch, and for 75 she is one fine lady.

Now IF there were a GOD I think it would have been more like this, In the begining God created the heavens and the earth. Where was he when he did this, if he created everything where was he standing/sitting/playing? Did he create himself at the same time? NO of course not, here is what was left out remembering that the BIBLE has been edited for content. God a normal 4 year old was playing one day in his sand box, he picked up a piece of sand in one hand and called it matter, in the other hand he picked up a piece of sand and called it antimatter, he saw that this was good and in his joy he clapped his hands together causing the BIG BANG. This woke his father from a nap and a good dream and he took his son spanked his little bottom and put him down for a nap, when GOD woke like most 4 year old's he went on to other things and forgot all about the BIG BANG.

I hope that answered your question.

River

[tugon (imported)]

I am fascinated about how God has progressed along with man. Before man was able to understand natural events like thunder, rain and other events they thought this was caused by a god. If there was a drought then the gods were punishing them and time to make a sacrifice. As man learned he could claim greater knowledge and fraternity with the gods he to was elevated to a higher level.

As man learned to create gods and use them for their own benefit they learned to control others. Today many religions pray to a single god or a trinity. Science has explained much of the phenomena that was previously attributed to gods so why have so many. Of course as we know many are still using god as a method of political power and control. They claim superiority of morals, values and more deserving of life's rewards.

We see their struggles for control during political campaigns, freedom of choices and wanting to change others ways of thinking. If they can not convince someone they are right they do not gain more power. I think christianity is waning as man progresses. I see this time as a last ditch effort to convince others that christianity is the team to join. As we throw off the mind's shackles and begin to question much of what we have been taught we find the bible and christianity no longer has the answers we need.

Do I believe in God? Yes but a very personal God. I do not believe in the Judeo-Christian depiction of God. I believe that Jesus was the son of God as we all are sons and daughters of my personal God. I could never accept Jesus as Lord and Master. I can accept him as someone to emulate as I can many throughout history that lived for peace and love. I am always amazed the part religion has played in the death of many who have preached love and peace. I awake each day with the plan of being the best person I can be. Some days I have more success than others.

Do I believe in the Devil? We all need to look within ourselves to find him. Again not the living in hell, collecting souls kind of devil but that part of ourselves the can be drawn to doing the wrong things. Who was more evil Hitler or those who chose to do nothing? Sin can be by action or inaction. Much of my sin comes from laziness and inaction when much needs to be done in the world.

Just my thoughts of the day.