Where does writing erotica and doing "kiddy porn" separate?

[msgtron (imported)]

Many of he stories posted, including mine, speak of young boys. Your web

site shows images of men and young boys. Is writing about this legal? Well,

am I exploting a mental image of a child for erotic pleasure or am a meerly

writing erotic literature?

Anybody out there a lawyer?

R.

[kathie (imported)]

Unfortunately, I have no answers for your question. I can only say that I am a bit confused, myself. The other day we were having a discussion about whether male homosexuals were pedophiles. I had always maintained that they were two separate issues, yet when you go over to the story section, many of the gay stories include young boys being deprived of their sex organs so that they could not enter puberty, but only service intact males. I guess then, that these erotic stories involving young boys could be called kiddie porn. I have a few male homosexual friends and I notice that they, who are in their 50's are going after young fellows in their twenties who drain them of their money. I keep telling them to go after men their own ages who are lonely and would appreciate a nice boyfriend, but they say they are not attracted to aging men, and that I don't understand. I guess that they are right. Can any of you gay men, or anyone in the know for that matter, straighten me out.

[erikboy (imported)]

Pederasty is cross-cultural phenomenon and I think that stories posted here about boys - it is just one form of it.

If it is legal or not I don't know. Depends on country of course.

There is an interesting article about Pederasty on Wikipedia with many more interesting links.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pederasty

E.

[A-1 (imported)]

Unfortunately, I have no answers for your question. I can only say that I am a bit confused, myself. The other day we were having a discussion about whether male homosexuals were pedophiles. I had always maintained that they were two separate issues, yet when you go over to the story section, many of the gay stories include young boys being deprived of their sex organs so that they could not enter puberty, but only service intact males. I guess then, that these erotic stories involving young boys could be called kiddie porn. I have a few male homosexual friends and I notice that they, who are in their 50's are going after young fellows in their twenties who drain them of their money. I keep telling them to go after men their own ages who are lonely and would appreciate a nice boyfriend, but they say they are not attracted to aging men, and that I don't understand. I guess that they are right. Can any of you gay men, or anyone in the know for that matter, straighten me out.

Kathie,

The most difficult thing is to correctly interpret what thought processes are going through the human mind. If you call ANY literature "Kiddie Porn" the implications are such that children are being hurt by it. Nothing is further from the truth here at the E.A.. Most probably, what you are seeing are the feelings expressed by adults who were hurt as children or whose fixations regarding such issues go back into their childhood.

Your few male homosexual friends probably are attracted to young boys (not necessarily children, but from 18ish to 25 or 30) IF the truth were known, heterosexual men also have such an attraction to females of the same age. I need only mention the most recent revelations (excuse the word) that emminates from the Fundamental Latter Day Saints 'church' in Texas. Of course, that seems lower on the repugnancy list since it IS heterosexual. In reality, children are children and it is NOT.

IF you read the literature in the E.A. many of the stories involve males who are nutered by females. There is even one about frontier times when a male is castrated because he expresses a desire for a girl his own age who is to be wed to a 50-ish patriarch in a polygamous marrage.

Remember, you cannot be ARRESTED for thoughts. Otherwise, the prisons would be much fuller than they are today.

Also, note that NO CHILD IS ALLOWED in the Archive as a member or anywhere where they can be harmed. However, an inner child exists in each of us and we are that child and that child IS us. It NEVER leaves and it must still be protected as a child is protected if our collective psyches are to remain intact.

In addition, there IS a difference in society between those who THINK of heinous deeds and those who commit heinous deeds. Just as there is a difference between those who write stories about heinous deeds in a fictional format and those who try to actually LIVE out their so-called 'fantasies', we CANNOT lump the thinkers and the doers into one catagory, even though the thought usually preceeds the deed. Sometimes, the thought can FOLLOW the deed such as that which happens in Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome.

I know of an E.A. member who lives every day contending with the serial molestation memories from his childhood. I am NOT a Psychologist nor a Psychiatrist. However, even I can see that the writing of these stories that bothers you is a catharsis for some and the only way that they remain sane. It is the only way for them to exorcise MULTIPLE demons from their memories of childhood abuses that MAINSTREAM society denies ever happened. In addition, insanity is measured by ACTIONS, not thoughts.

Specific threats against an actual person with a name and identity IS a problem, because ideations are being made. However, fictional people are constructs, not real and nobody is being threatened, you see? Think of Silence of the Lambs. The people are fictional. IF a real person was being written about, then we have a problem that must be dealt with. Some ARE real stories, but they are autobiographies that are fictionalized.

As you read and are more and more disgusted with the E.A. Archives remember this. Man's inhumanity to man is without limit. If you are a Christian the sacrifice of Jesus Christ only covers this IF the victim first forgives the offender. If the one who wronged you IS dead, that one can no longer hurt you or anyone else. However, the fact that you have psychic scars cannot be denied nor dealt with easily and you no longer have an outlet to vent rage upon. That rage must NOT be allowed to be turned outward nor inward or violence will be visited upon an innocent. The only way to surgically revise a scar is to cut it out and dispose of it. Then the healing WITHOUT the infectious scar can begin.

Whatever you do, please do what you can to lessen the evil that humanity does to itself. Ignoring it or supressing it DOES NOT MAKE IT GO AWAY, it only allows it to fester and to breed corruption that infects the uninfected. Sometimes evil must be forgiven, but sometimes mankind is not capable of that level of forgivness. Sometimes evil must be extracted and placed in an isolated place where it can do no harm and it is isolated in a sterile environment.

Think of the E.A. Archive as a JAR OF SCARS soaking in PUS and things start making a lot more sense.

[Slammr (imported)]

Many of he stories posted, including mine, speak of young boys. Your web

site shows images of men and young boys. Is writing about this legal? Well,

am I exploting a mental image of a child for erotic pleasure or am a meerly

writing erotic literature?

Anybody out there a lawyer?

R.

It depends on the country you're from. If you live in the USA, the Bill of Rights, Freedom of Speech, does protect you. As long as you don't have the kid you're writing about tied up in your basement, what you're writing is not illegal. You probably wouldn't want your family or employer to know what you're writing, though. They might not understand that it's all fantasy.

Why would someone write erotic, castration, stories about kids?

Writing is therapeutic. It's a way to resolve childhood issues. Often, once put down on paper, certain things no longer have control over one. Also, many here have wished since they can remember that they were castrated, and many wish they were castrated as children. Writing about that is - in some ways - a means to fulfill that wish.

Why, then, write about kids having sex?

Some people were abused as children, and writing about it is a way to work through it. When I write about a kid, I put myself in that kid's place. I'm not writing about what I'd like to do to a kid, I'm exploring what I would feel like, were I in his position.

Going through puberty is possibly one of the most intensely emotional periods of one's life. Why wouldn't one want to explore that period and write about it?

Sometimes, an erotic story about a teenage boy is just fun. Hollywood has even made several of them. It doesn't mean that the author intends to run out to find a boy to have sex with.

18 is an arbitrary age determined by society that has little to do with sexuality. Does anyone think kids are waiting until 18 to have sex? I doubt that any kids were influenced to have sex or to be castrated by any stories posted on the Archive.

Look around the forum. There are pages and pages discussing this subject. Perhaps someone will post a link to one of the threads.

I'm a Freedom of Speech freak. Although I'm very much against Child Porn, pictures of a REAL child being abused, I'm against all restrictions on all other forms of expression. I thing one should be able to think, write, or post on the Internet ANYTHING that didn't require someone being harmed to produce. There should be no restrictions WHATSOEVER on the writen word, on drawings, or on computer generated graphics.

I'm always pushing the limits, so by all means, stay away from any website I run, althouh, y

ou won't find stories or pictures of chidren on them.

Unfortunately, I have no answers for your question. I can only say that I am a bit confused, myself. The other day we were having a discussion about whether male homosexuals were pedophiles. I had always maintained that they were two separate issues, yet when you go over to the story section, many of the gay stories include young boys being deprived of their sex organs so that they could not enter puberty, but only service intact males. I guess then, that these erotic stories involving young boys could be called kiddie porn. I have a few male homosexual friends and I notice that they, who are in their 50's are going after young fellows in their twenties who drain them of their money. I keep telling them to go after men their own ages who are lonely and would appreciate a nice boyfriend, but they say they are not attracted to aging men, and that I don't understand. I guess that they are right. Can any of you gay men, or

anyone in the know for that matter, straighten me out.

There are homosexuals that are pedophiles and there are heterosexuals that are pedophiles, probably in equal percentages. Haven't we had ample evidence that older heterosexuals like younger women, too? Just read the newspapers. Far more reports of older men chasing younger women make the news than does reports of older men chasing younger men, and plenty of men in their 50s are being drained of their money by young ladies in their 20s.

[StefanIsMe (imported)]

My answer to this question is always to refer the person to mainstream and not-so-mainstream published media. Guy Madden films (out of Manitoba, Canada) (he did one about slave-boys, 10-12, on a sex farm one time); Anne Rice, who wrote of underage gay vampires; The Heart is Deceitful above all things; etc etc. Talking of movies, I've seen even more blatant stuff in the foreign-films bin.

Canada tried to jail one guy, I forget his name.. he wrote some scathingly sexual stuff online, it was pure kiddy-porn, extreme stuff from the edited portions published. They did arrest him etc etc but freed him after a time, written off as a failed exersize. However, as stated above, I've never felt that anything I've read on the E.A. is as gratuitous as this particular author was.

[stewie69 (imported)]

Fiction is fiction. As long as it isn't based on some real life event, what's the problem? There's a wide variety of disturbing subjects in this world than many folks enjoy in literature and film. As long as they're enjoyed as a concept and not an actual act, there's no harm. What if everyone who enjoyed slasher flicks became serial killers?...

[IbPervert (imported)]

At the moment there is no crime for writing ones thought down. Although, other people could be alarmed if found, and there is the potential for legal officials to step in. A good example is a written journal. A written journal is considered private, but in the court of law can be used against you with or with out your consent and a court order....at least in the United States.

[BossTamsin (imported)]

Ok. A question has been asked, and will be answered.

The question of legality largely depends on what country you live in. Unfortunately there exist a number of countries which have 'child pornography' laws so sweeping that even fictional stories about imaginary children are enough to convict you as a pedophile. I cannot say whether or not any of the readers are living in such a country, for that answer you will have to consult an attorney in your jurisdiction.

I am not a legal expert, I'm not even a legal amateur, but to the best of my knowledge such writings are covered under 'freedom of speech' within the United States. At least for the moment. I somehow suspect that this will eventually change. If an elected official gets riled up enough to propose a bill banning such activity, I would fully expect it to pass. "Freedom of speech" is one thing, but I doubt any member of government would be willing to go on record as being FOR child pornography, which is how the press would see it. Even if it is a first amendment issue, that won't matter. The headlines screaming that "Senator X supports kiddie porn" would be enough to sink them for life. In today's world, you don't even have to be convicted. All the police have to do is lay charges, and your life is over. The courts could throw the case out, nobody would care. Matlock himself could prove you innocent, it wouldn't matter.

My personal opinion is that free speech means just that. Someone can do the most horrible, awful, stomach-turning things to an imaginary being, but that does not mean in any way shape or form that they would ever do anything of the sort to a real person. If you are willing to try, convict, and sentence a person based on a work of fiction then everyone who has ever played Quake, World of Warcraft, Max Payne, any FPS game, 90% of any games on the market - all of them should immediately stand trial for first degree murder. If writing fiction about children makes you a pedophile, then clearly playing any violent game makes you a murderer.

My opinion, of course, is just that. It's not legal advice. The official EA position is that we accept these kind of stories. We always have, and if I can help it, we always will. Thoughtcrime (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thoughtcrime) should never be allowed to exist. That being said, there are times I wish the EA had the budget to consult lawyers in both the US and Canada regarding these issues, to determine what kind of liability the Archive (and management) may have regarding these stories.

Issues like these are what keeps me awake at night.

[FianceeUvBigGuy (imported)]

Good Morning, all.

Yoli at the keyboard (Not a Steinway.)

I must confess that this issue has troubled me since my initial foray into the EA.

Not only do I share the concerns re the legal ramifications of some of the stories and links, but I'm curious (Note that I did NOT say "condemnatory") as to the motivations of those create or seek stories involving minors.

I've made myself try to read some of the stories of the nature in question, so well as checking out related links. Suffice it to say that I was saddened and, yes, even repelled by some of it.

PLEASE! Note that I am NOT singling anyone out, NOR am I intentionally insulting anyone. It's just that I think the safety and innocence of children should be "Job One" in all aspects of life.

I don't want any, not one, of my "family" here to find themselves in legal troubles and I sometimes wonder when the hammer will fall.

If, by creating or reading tales of that nature, a person is able to sublimate, rather than act on, some dark impulse then perhaps it's better that they have that outlet. Still, I wonder if some "passer by", might stumble over these things and thereby a dreadful seed be planted.

We do, often, have casual visitors to the EA and we cannot be confident that they all know where the boundaries of behavior are or that they will respect them.

Love to all,

Yoli