Surpressed Sadistic Tendancies Combined With the Inability to Cause Harm

[kantfeelStuff (imported)]

ok long story...

first off, im messed up, i know it and you will soon know a part of it. As some of you know i have castration fantasies, not weird but a sexual deviation nonetheless.

this will be VERY revealing into my past, it deals with child abuse and sadistic fanasies. If you are not comfortable with reading this then please stop from reading.

im taking out a bunch of fluff here, and if you want the whole story then just post asking for more and i will PM you.

i was beaten as a child, a lot. and now i am becoming sexually active with a girl who just asked me not one hour ago "what are your fantasies?" i dont want to admit the castration fantasies becasue i dont see them becoming a part of my sex life before i find someone i can truly trust[or they are on an anonymous forum:)]

anyways...

i was thinking of all my other fantasies i have one, a really romantic day: diner, quiet movie, slow lovemaking, etc.

another is being the dominant or sadistic lover, with handcuffs, blindfolds, etc. this is where my problem arises:(.

i want to do these things, ive even tried them with my girlfriend on a few occasions, nothing to hardcore just grabbing hard and hair pulling. but as i tried to bring these fantasies more into the light [handcuffs /blindfolds /complete dominance] i could not.

when ever i tried to act out my fantasies of causing pain, even in a completely open and safe way, something inside me stopped me. i got this feeling of fear and total regret. i could not even get it up from there, all i could think of is leaving and its MY HOUSE. i dont know what it was but i have a complete inability to cause pain, even if i want to.

this is where my beatings come in, i think that the fact that i was beaten for most of my life is stopping me from fulfilling my deepest fantasies. i think that the fact that i was beaten is the basis for why i dont want to inflict any pain on any other in any way.

just to fill you in more... i was sometimes beaten until i either passed out or was bleeding. and i think that, that is the reason that i am so scared when it comes to me inflicting pain on others, even if i want to [in a good way].

in the situation i was put into before when i tried to act on my fantasies what happened was i froze, i felt the familiar feeling of fear and dread full me up, and my gut clenched. i was in an extremely erotic situation and i lost any and all desire to have sex.

i have talked it over with my girlfriend, and as some of you know she is extremely masochistic, and she cannot relate on any level though she tries. i care for her so much and i want to fulfill her fantasies as well, so i am stuck between a rock and a hard place. i am unable to fulfill my own fantasies and someone else's.

this all came to the surface and hit me in the face when she asked me, "what are your fantasies?" i know what i like but i am unable to act on it.

i am a sadist, i admit it, but how can i act on this if i cannot get past my fear?

p.s. i have been to MANY therapists and none have helped, i have been completely honest with them and they never give me any advice, they just nod there head or ask another question on how that affects me...

i want to know how to get past this so i can be on the road to happiness like so many of you:)

i know this isnt the exact place to be posting this, but you all have been so helpful in the past i thought i would be able to turn to you for at least some helpful advice. and please dont just tell me to go to anther therapist, they dont help with this specific thing.

Thank you all so much for you help in the past and any help you can give me,

G

[gpb3aol (imported)]

Dam, I know you won't like this reply but I'd go find a new therapist. You need to reslove your issues about the person or persons who beat you.

[tugon (imported)]

kfS this is a good place to let us know about you. Several of us have written our autobiographies here. I have a question for you. Do you feel you are a sadist or dealing with some inner rage from being abused? Since being sadisitc does not seem to bring you sexual stimulation I question your sadism. I undersatnd inner rage and the desire to strike out but it has never been sexual for me.

Talking and sharing has been very helpful for me. Recovering from abuse can be a lengthy process. There are no magic words or quick fixes. Please continue to share with us and do seek professional help as needed. You will begin to understand yourself and your motivations. Try not to become what someone else wants you to be. Look within yourself and figure out who you are. Not what you have been told in the past from abusers but find your genuine self.

Good luck on the healing road.

[JoaoGenerico (imported)]

Being horribly pragmatic: what if you put some real effort in your sadistic education so you can uncouple the concepts of "causing pain" from "doing harm". If you have confidence in your technique and know the anatomy/physiology of pain well, you may be less concerned about harming your partner.

But this is the SECONDARY benefit. The MAIN benefit would be experiencing your sadism as something that is your construction, and is under your control. Maybe this can uncouple it from your past history of abuse (after all, beating a child is a demonstration of LACK of control) and you will no longer identify with your abuser.

* * *

As a masochist, I can tell that I have hard work to convince some partners that inflicting pain and harming (or abusing) are completely different beasts. I've repeated this dialogue countless times:

"-- I don't want to give you pain, I want you to feel good!"

"-- Darling, giving me pain *IS* making me feel good... why else would I want it?"

[kantfeelStuff (imported)]

Being horribly pragmatic: what if you put some real effort in your sadistic education so you can uncouple the concepts of "causing pain" from "doing harm". If you have confidence in your technique and know the anatomy/physiology of pain well, you may be less concerned about harming your partner.

But this is the SECONDARY benefit. The MAIN benefit would be experiencing your sadism as something that is your construction, and is under your control. Maybe this can uncouple it from your past history of abuse (after all, beating a child is a demonstration of LACK of control) and you will no longer identify with your abuser.

* * *

As a masochist, I can tell that I have hard work to convince some partners that inflicting pain and harming (or abusing) are completely different beasts. I've repeated this dialogue countless times:

"-- I don't want to give you pain, I want you to feel good!"

"-- Darling, giving me pain *IS* making me feel good... why else would I want it?"

Thank you SO much, like i knew what would happen someone told me to go to another therapist, but you had such helpful advice Thank You.

I will make sure to do that research, i just recently found that i was a sadist and i have done no real research on the topic other then just psychological research sites and wikipedia.

And my gf said that EXACT thing,

"-- Darling, giving me pain *IS* making me feel good... why else would I want it?"

at least now i know im not the first person who had has this problem.

Thank you so much again,

G

[bobov (imported)]

Since I know nothing about you other than what you've written here, any advice I can give you is limited by my ignorance. That said, here's my take:

In any primary childhood relationship, a person learns two roles - the one he takes, and the one taken by the other. You learned how to be beaten; you also learned how to beat. Of the two, the beater was the one with freedom, power, and status. Now that you're older, you're trying to build a stable adult identity from parts of your childhood. It's only natural that you'd explore the possibilities of being a beater. However, as you're discovering, it's one thing to play the part of a beater, but it's another to feel as a beater feels. You know how to beat, but you may not know how or why beaters enjoy it. You may not be the same as the one (or ones) who beat you long ago.

You mention you were sometimes beaten until you bled or passed out. This means you were harmed physically as well as emotionally. There's no love or affection in hurting others. Perhaps you'd like to convince yourself that those who hurt you also loved you. Perhaps they did, but if they loved you, they failed to express it. It seems to me that, familiar as you are with being hurt, you instinctively recoil from hurting those you love, even though the ones you loved as a child did hurt you.

My advice is that, as difficult as this may now seem, you needn't be a prisoner of your past. You're not doomed to repeat your childhood experiences again and again, even if they were bad. There's a third way: don't be beaten; don't be a beater; love the ones you love, with all the tenderness, kindness, and generosity that love implies. You know you don't want to be beaten again. You also know that beating someone is not loving them, which is why you're having such difficulty beating a girl you love.

You're confused because you haven't left the beaten/beater duality behind. You can. A good therapist can help you do that. I'd suggest a behavioral therapist, who can teach you things to do to express love, rather than the "talking cure" analysts you've seen. Psychoanalysis makes self-knowledge paramount, with self-acceptance the goal. But I don't think that what you need is to spend several years building an elaborate theory of your own psychology in order to wind up where you started. What you need is to acquire the behavioral skills to move forward with your life and achieve your goal of a loving relationship free of your childhood traumas. You can do it. You just need to understand what you want - not to be a more effective sadist, even if sadism is a dead-end for you, but to do what makes you happy.

[kantfeelStuff (imported)]

dont worry about me learning to move on, i have. i have learned over the years to love and to express it as such, i have never hurt another person accept in self defense [and drunken boxing].

i have realized everything you have said more then i may have put on, i am a very kind and generous person.

but what i am now trying to do is to broaden myself by becoming a new more experimental person. i have found that i enjoy being dominate in sex and i want to be able to experience that. but my past is holding me back in some aspects, i have explained this to my gf and she is very understanding but i still want to overcome it for my own well being in the future.

from the advice JoaoGenerico gave me i have more confidence in myself, and i will be SLOWLY be experimenting with my sexuality. i will be taking very small steps and i hope that one day i might be able to completely over come my past. i may have moved on, but i may never forgive which is the hardest part.

Thank you for the advice, and seeing as i have never been to a behavioral therapist i will try that.

Thank you for being to helpful,

G

[A-1 (imported)]

I think that you are mixing up two things that are not related.

Unless you had sexual feelings during your abuse then the abuse and the sex are NOT related.

Why make the connection now?

If your ability to experiment with S&M is not what you think that it should be then maybe you were just not cut out for S&M as a sexual outlet. Maybe, just maybe, you are like the majority of those who practice sex.

You state in your original post...

i want to do these things, ive even tried them with my girlfriend on a few occasions, nothing to hardcore just grabbing hard and hair pulling. but as i tried to bring these fantasies more into the light [handcuffs /blindfolds /complete dominance] i could not.

when ever i tried to act out my fantasies of causing pain, even in a completely open and safe way, something inside me stopped me. i got this feeling of fear and total regret. i could not even get it up from there, all i could think of is leaving and its MY HOUSE. i dont know what it was but i have a complete inability to cause pain, even if i want to.

this is where my beatings come in, i think that the fact that i was beaten for most of my life is stopping me from fulfilling my deepest fantasies. i think that the fact that i was beaten is the basis for why i dont want to inflict any pain on any other in any way.

...welcome to the world of the NORMAL. (Vanilla, as it were) Not everyone gets sexual fulfillment from S&M. Maybe, just maybe, you are one of those people.

...You mention "fantasies" but you DO NOT elaborate.

Are the "fantasies" you tell us of yours, or your partner's?

If you are NOT turned on then you MUST entertain the possibility that you may NEVER be turned on by S&M.

So, if your partner likes it, then DO IT for your partner. YOU DO NOT have to get pleasure to GIVE pleasure.

Sex is supposed to be fulfillment. Obviously, if you are not sexually stimulated by the practice of S&M then you are not going to be fulfilled by it. O.K.?

BOTTOM LINE.

If you want pleasure, then do what YOU find the most pleasurable. If you want to GIVE pleasure, then do what YOUR PARTNER finds the most pleasurable.

Sometimes, we cannot allow ourselves to recieve pleasure unless we give it. When YOU can convince yourself that what you are doing to your partner is pleasurable for your partner, then perhaps your fear of hurting your partner will go away.

That is why S&M practicioners have "safe words" or some signal to communicate when the play is too intense so that the dominant one can STOP what they are doing to the submissive one when the submissive one is no longer being pleasured by it.

The whole chemical key to pleasure and pain is the endorphins released during extreme stimulation. Some release more endorphins wih pain than with pleasure. These are S&M affectionados.

The problem is, during one of the sessions, if the DOMINANT starts recieving pleasure from the actions upon the submissive, then the dominant no longer has control over doing permanent harm to the submissive. Such harm can be EITHER physical or Psychological.

Therefore, Dominants should be careful when their actions cause them pleasure, because endoprphins are like a powerful drug. A dominant under their influence can lose control and that is how people can get hurt or killed during an S&M encounter.

When you start down this road, you are likely not to ever experience normal sex in a normal way again if YOU start getting too much pleasure as a DOMINANT. If you cannot get pleasure as a SUBMISSIVE, it is going to be a TALL order to be submissive just because your partner demands it, and you SHOULD NOT be submissive under those circumstances and that is because THEY are out of control as a DOMINANT. Do you see?

Oh yes!

Be sure to check the laws in your area because tying somebody up against their will WILL leave marks and that can get you jail time. Especially if they show up in an ER with marks from a whipping/spanking and/or bruises.

Understand?

Remember. S&M is a psychological effect rather than a PHYSICAL effect. In fact, professionals have submissives sign CONTRACTS to protect themselves.

If S&M is more PHYSICAL than PSYCHOLOGICAL then something is terribly, terribly wrong and somebody's going to get hurt.