Emotional response to men as a chemically castrated eunuch, on Androcur almost 12 wks

[bunnimon (imported)]

I have difficulty not thinking as questions like what kind of car do you drive requires some contemplation if you don't own one . Many of the questions are too obscure or don't relate to me, so some imagination is definately required and how that affects the results is questionable. If the question is not something I had ever considered before I need to think which relates to myself more. If I was in a different mood couldn't I have made different choices changing the results? Perhaps I'm overcomplicating it.

Honesty, I expect, would be more important than not thinking. While the individual questions are often immediately obvious as to their gender stereotypes, I meant if you know yourself then the outcome/"answer" of the test should be vaguely accurate, as opposed to constructing an answer to suit an outcome you'd prefer. Being confused about your gender may cause the outcome to not be what you are expecting. Hope that clears it up a little.

Using this as a self-evaluation is tricky. As I pointed out I took the test 3 years apart and I don't feel that my personal values had changed greatly nor my hormone levels or types and the outcome was a little different. Do you think it is that accurate that I should judge this as a change in myself or could it be that it's not perfect? It seems that you have gone through a definite change in your overall personality which was perhaps vaguely represented in the results, although imperfectly. Is this possible?

[DonFL (imported)]

The problem is if you think about the question, it effects the outcome of the test. This is why the MMPI is so $@%$@ long, its designed to get you in a instant check off of the first reaction by flat out being so dauntingly long..

Self Evel is very tricky, so is having an evaluator. The person who is doing the evaluation is going to effect the results of the test with their own personal wishes, what they want the test to reflect. Many tests are built to protect against this, and its why many tests have lost credibility (like the ink-blot tests..)

Many of these tests are built for the cross sectional average, if you have a test with a quantity non applicable questions, it evidently isn't the right one for you.

Gender tests can often be swayed by the desire of the test taker, especially shorter ones, this is one of the problems of using standard tests for gender evaluation instead of true personal questioning and interviews.

[_g (imported)]

The only link to the S.A.G.E. test is this, and it has been updated since the last time I took it, Link: http://www.hemingways.org/GIDinfo/sage/index.htm

[bunnimon (imported)]

The problem is if you think about the question, it effects the outcome of the test. This is why the MMPI is so $@%$@ long, its designed to get you in a instant check off of the first reaction by flat out being so dauntingly long..

So they think they can make a person be honest by boring them into losing concerntration. :-\ Wooo hypnotic meditation.

Self Evel is very tricky, so is having an evaluator. The person who is doing the evaluation is going to effect the results of the test with their own personal wishes, what they want the test to reflect.

How do you know they ARE going to effect the results?

Here's a question for you and I don't want you to answer straight away:

How honest are you when thinking about multiple choice questions?

A. I lie compulsively

B. I tell some white lies

C. I think I am reasonable truthful

D. I am honest and completely unbiased about who I am

Hmmm... If you answered A, B or D perhaps it is best that you trust your sub-counscious mind to do the talking for you.

BTW I don't know about you but in every single multiple choice questionaire I have done in my life has had the kind of issues I pointed out and I am not the first person to think this way.

Like the question that asked about myself and my family. It had a range of responses from stable to completely disfunctional. I consider my family members to be in severe need of therapy but I don't think this about myself. How would you answer this issue honestly without thinking? Any answer is not the truth.

[Tclosetgirl (imported)]

um.. i can confirm that hormones tend to re-wire your sexual attractions from my personal experance..

Me2..

[bunnimon (imported)]

Before taking hormones I was bisexual and after aswell. I don't believe that sexuality changes unless of course some sexual repression has been eased in the process. Possibility? Otherwise homosexual men with high testosterone wouldn't exist. If it really did rewire sexuality then the psychiatric community could have treated gay men with a simple dose of HRT back when it was considered a disease. Taking hormones you are not accustomed to will make a person feel quite different for a time. I was temporarily looking at men more than usual when I started taking hormones but you grow accustomed the new levels aswell.

Hormones don't magically change who you are and I think the point is for the hormones to reflect your identity, so you are mentally and physically sound. They should improve your sense of wellbeing rather than transform you into someone/thing else.

[mrt (imported)]

Before taking hormones I was bisexual and after aswell. I don't believe that sexuality changes unless of course some sexual repression has been eased in the process. Possibility? Otherwise homosexual men with high testosterone wouldn't exist. If it really did rewire sexuality then the psychiatric community could have treated gay men with a simple dose of HRT back when it was considered a disease. Taking hormones you are not accustomed to will make a person feel quite different for a time. I was temporarily looking at men more than usual when I started taking hormones but you grow accustomed the new levels aswell.

Hormones don't magically change who you are and I think the point is for the hormones to reflect your identity, so you are mentally and physically sound. They should improve your sense of wellbeing rather than transform you into someone/thing else.

I think my comment offended you. They were not meant to! I'm not saying that homones or lack of them create homosexuality or anything of the sort.

For one I do not think being gay is a disease or an issue that needs a cure.

What I was saying / repeating were the comments of one man who was hetrosexual and was castrated and put on female homones due to cancer who reported to me a shift in what gender turns him on. And from my weird juggling act with hormones I also noticed some odd changes in how I looked at people. I've also heard from several others that they noticed changes that went along with changes in what type of hormone fueled them.

Now, how far that goes or what value it has? Thats a much larger question. I don't think its a black and white thing one way or the other. We have people born male that had a sex change and became lesbians or straight and who they were attracted to before the surgery/hormones was not always how they ended up with afterwards.

Maybe this topic should have its own thread?

[bunnimon (imported)]

Wow! Not easily offended here. And I was actually responding to the previous post not yours.

Nor did anyone suggest that homosexuality is a disease or imply that anyone's opinion on this thread was currently such. Don't assume too much or we will get ahead of ourselves.

Sexuality's inability to be treated with hormones was my point, so why would anyone's sexuality be changed. I can't see how it's possible to biologically change through hormones or surgery unless a person was originally attracted to a that sex and felt repressed. Through therapy, personal, social or professional, which often occurs during hrt a person might be able address those repressed feelings sure. The hormones themselves will not alter anything in the longterm. Re-wiring sexuality as was suggested, I would hard pressed to believe unless some evidence of this was presented.

Magnus hirschfield claimed to have cured homosexuality by transplanting a heterosexuals testicles into a gay man, but I think he was just getting desperate when homosexuals looked like a likely target for eugenicism by the Nazis.

The best current sciencetific evidence is that sexual orientation is biological (possibly genetic) and cannot be altered. In my list of definitions I perhaps should have stated that sexual orientation is independent of gender identity, primary sex characteristics and hormone levels.

[kristoff]

Interesting discussion, viz a viz., change of sexual orientation. This in lite of the fact that 15-20% or so of respondents to the EA survey reported a "change of sexual orientation." Personally, I find the numbers to be extremely improbable, though I can't entirely dismiss the notion. Those types of questions in the survey did not account for hormonal replacements or lack thereof, as well as issues of closets and other things. On the other hand, hormonal implications would tend to auger for a genetic disposition. That aside, my thought would tend toward release of sexual orientation inhibition, as has been suggested, notably with a release from other inhibitions, i,.e, the results of long-sought castration. I would encourage the furrtherance of this discussion. Consider yourselves challenged by the old wench, er nun......

Articles resulting from the EA survey, go here:

http://www.eunuch.org/vbulletin/show

thread.php?t=11449

[bunnimon (imported)]

Percentages is exactly how homosexuality was first determined to be biological as opposed to contagious which was a common concept at the time. Still is in some people's messed up minds. If homosexuality was social and not biological there would be much more variation, however these figures remained consistant. A conservative estimate would be around 4% as opposed to Kinsley's 10% in prisons where sexual preference does not offer a lot of options. Given the various hormones in foods that could affect early development pushing the number higher.

Bisexuality is given a higher percentage than homosexuality and some studies go as high as 20%. Another thing I have noticed is that this forum appears to have a much higher occurence of homosexuality than the general population. Correct me if I am wrong? If you are homosexual noone is going to judge you here, which makes coming out or coming to terms with your own identity a much easier process.

Perhaps the figures are not entirely improbably, especially with those who blush at a guy as their hormones change and suddenly proclaim that their sexual orientation has transmigrated.