Cutters Beware

[Paolo]

Please remember that whatever you may read as this trial continues that there are real people at the end of all this. What you read won

’t be the whole truth, it’

ll be sensationalised. Whatever your thoughts about the activities of this group there’s people who’ve been living with the stress of an possible trial for over a year.

Thank you for pointing this out.

Of course the media will react like this, if it continues to hold their interest.

As the old saying goes: "If it bleeds, it leads."

[keyman419 (imported)]

Putting my moderator hat on for this comment.

I am fine with this being discussed so long as the comments in support of people are like what Magusuk89 or Manc-Wannabe are saying in support of getting SOC 8 adopted by the medical community in the UK.

I was at a convention this past weekend and I was talking to several other asexual men and I mentioned that I have had nullification surgery. Someone else in the room overheard my comment and came up to me and started asking several questions about the procedure. He then told me that he identifies as MtE and is seeking surgical castration. We talked later the next day and he is following all the US medical processes and has started meds and has surgical consults scheduled to achieve his needs. I offered my support in advice however I can. He was so excited to meet someone in real life who has had a procedure done.

I guess what I'm trying to admit is that while I was somewhat taken by surprise I'm honored to meet someone else who is also seeking the procedure the correct way and that I can offer support from my experiences. There really are more out there than we realize and the medical systems need to keep up.

[HumanFly (imported)]

Assuming any truth to the allegations as described in the article (I tend to have doubts about most media...) it would seem like being a cutter isn't all that profitable as an income stream either....

That works out to GBP 33K / year for the site... Not sure about UK standards, but in the US that is in the "minum wage" level income if one person got it all. No info about how the take was split, but assuming it was an even split, each of the nine got about GBP 3.7K / year, which hardly seems like enough to get very excited about, let alone justify the risks of the likely jail sentences they are facing....

I also notice that while the article mostly talked about the surgeries, but there was a mention also of making and distributing "an indecent image of a child" - what are the odds that the court is more bothered by the kiddy porn than the surgery, even if the paper was more interested in talking about the more unusual surgeries? No idea....

I do agree w/ Magus that it seems like a bad thing for getting good progress towards SOC 8, and hope it comes to a speedy resolution that gets the news people off the case....

WheelyCurious

What's in dispute isn't that they were doing unlicensed surgeries; the bit the media reported that was inaccurate is that there's such a thing as a eunuch or nullo cult which both they and we are a part of.

[Blondboyless (imported)]

Are there supports in the UK to get surgery through official channels like their universal healthcare system?

[manc-wannabe (imported)]

No there is not. The U.K. doesn’t provide ANY support to the eunuch or non binary community; even private gender clinics only offer binary surgeries. I contacted 2 clinics before going to Mexico and got strong, almost abusive, replies that they did not offer that type of surgery.

I’ve heard the odd rumour that things may be changing though. Someone in one of my chat groups reported that a U.K. clinic was offering them nullo surgery for £30k including the required letters and associated psych consultations. It may be hearsay, but if it’s true, perhaps things are changing.

[Losethem (imported)]

No there is not. The U.K. doesn’t provide ANY support to the eunuch or non binary community; even private gender clinics only offer binary surgeries. I contacted 2 clinics before going to Mexico and got strong, almost abusive, replies that they did not offer that type of surgery.

I’ve heard the odd rumour that things may be changing though. Someone in one of my chat groups reported that a U.K. clinic was offering them nullo surgery for £30k including the required letters and associated psych consultations. It may be hearsay, but if it’s true, perhaps things are changing.

I almost have to think the reason things are so vociferously against folks like us in the UK, is one of the leaders at WPATH was very against the Eunuch and non-binary chapters and actively worked, in my opinion, to sabotage them to prevent them from becoming adopted. That particular individual is probably the highest ranking WPATH person with British citizenship, so it wouldn't surprise me at all if he has the ear of practitioners in the UK telling them things like "You can just ignore that..." or the like. I have no proof, but for me it wouldn't be such a leap that he would be bending the ear of anyone in the UK willing to listen, so that only his view on this subject is adopted there.

[manc-wannabe (imported)]

The media are reporting tonight that the government is going to change the law to effectively remove the ability to change gender. Gender will be defined as biological, ie birth gender only - and you will be legally treated as that regardless of any medical or social transition. It will be legal to exclude someone on the basis of birth gender and in hospital you will be put in the ward of your birth gender. This means that there is absolutely zero chance of any favourable treatment of eunuch or non binary. I’m literally shaking with rage tonight.

[Losethem (imported)]

The media are reporting tonight that the government is going to change the law to effectively remove the ability to change gender. Gender will be defined as biological, ie birth gender only - and you will be legally treated as that regardless of any medical or social transition. It will be legal to exclude someone on the basis of birth gender and in hospital you will be put in the ward of your birth gender. This means that there is absolutely zero chance of any favourable treatment of eunuch or non binary. I

’m literally shaking with rage tonight.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are the Tories only in power at the moment because they can hold off an election for a certain amount of time? IE No early election can be called, and they wouldn't anyhow, because if they held it today they'd probably lose by a significant margin?

I look forward to hearing you're taking part in a general strike against the government. Seems to be all the rage over on the continent (literally). The French may surrender when they see an opposing tank, but I have to admire their willingness to go on strike when people significantly overstep their boundaries.

[stanfeldman (imported)]

This is typical of allowing, or in the modern thoughtless practice of requesting that government be involved in your private life and or to engage in the decisions surrounding your individual being. There is no one who holds dominion over you and your body or me and my body save for the spirit in charge of each respectively. The rest of mankind has no business and absolutely no right to tell you what you can or should, do, or have done, to your body. This is the perfect example of why it is paramount that not just the people of America pull their head out of their ass but the world over. Take heed of the words written in the Constitution of The United States, and it can be seen why the World used to have a special place in their universe for The USA. You see they said ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL. That meant in those days, PEOPLE, Human beings as we are here each of us individually and all of us not just americans. they meant That to say no one has a right to tell you how to do you. that you alone had that sovereign right as it had been traditionally only elites that had such freedom. The truth is the Constitution is correct and that was the one thing that spares the; in many ways, evil men who wrote it from the forgetfulness of our history books. Those words are TRUE. and the TRUTH is non negotiable. it is not a thing that can be rewritten to better suit ones desire. it is what it is. and the smartest and the best of us will recognize it and accept it even when that is a hard thing to do. I admit that as it stands today America is a fucking Joke! but that isn't something that i support or supported and as long as i am alive, even if it is alone i will stand up for the Principals of individual sovereignty, and unalienable rights, as did those few who are the reason behind any amount of freedoms that can be had today. i will do as i please to myself, and should i carry on in private with willing companions to whatever consensual desires i may have with myself or the previously mentioned with there selves, and the elites, the governments, the Alphabet agencies and the sniveling bitches that don't like it of the world can go fuck themselves if they are not happy about what is my choice for myself. PLAIN and SIMPLE. there will be no wavering and THERE WILL BE NO SUBMITTING TO Demand, it is wholly not anyone's place to decide my mind body or spirit on my behalf, for any interest save me and my own, which requires my consent and that alone to carry on any action or the prevention thereof.

[magusuk89 (imported)]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are the Tories only in power at the moment because they can hold off an election for a certain amount of time? IE No early election can be called, and they wouldn't anyhow, because if they held it today they'd probably lose by a significant margin?

I look forward to hearing you're taking part in a general strike against the government. Seems to be all the rage over on the continent (literally). The French may surrender when they see an opposing tank, but I have to admire their willingness to go on strike when people significantly overstep their boundaries.

This is true.

At the moment if there were an election the Tories would face a massive drubbing, and this has consistently happened in by-elections. Take for example the historic North Shropshire by-election last year, where there was a 34% swing -- close to a record -- and the Liberal Democrats took a seat held by the Tories for a couple of centuries.

More than that, though, people who would traditionally vote Conservative (Tory) are alarmed that the party is currently controlled by a faction that represent only a small part of the ideological family that the party traditionally covers, and one that is at loggerheads with the priorities of the rest. Concern at what the executive is doing with its power prior to an election it statistically cannot win is shared across the spectrum, and there is a sense that this represents a constitutional crisis.

As a result, many are gathering round the King to offer some sort of anchor of moral stability, but the monarch in our constitution cannot get involved in politics, and has to remain neutral owing to the settlement after the revolution in 1688. Nevertheless he keeps hammering out the message that harmony and care of the environment is central to national survival, and his stress on how volunteers have had to step up to stock and staff food banks in his Christmas Day speech has not gone unnoticed.

Because the current government has only one trick left to try to win popular support, which is to play on fear, they are cooking up various demographics to be fearful of, and one of these is trans people. Hold on tight, because this is going to be a rough ride... but the silent majority is in favour of personal rights and is sympathetic to LGBT+ people, and we have more friends than we realise. The important thing to do is to become more proud and more visible -- and harder to demonise. Things will change at the next election.