Estrogen and Male Development

[JesusA (imported)]

While there is a great deal of information on the Eunuch Archive about the effects of testosterone on males and on estrogen for Male-to-Female transitioning, there is relatively little on the role of estrogen in normal male development. This is a very brief introduction to some of the issues that need to be considered.

A first point is that all normal males produce estrogen as well as testosterone. The enzyme aromatase turns testosterone into estradiol in some parts of the body where it is essential for normal functioning. Some of this happens before birth, some at puberty, and some is part of normal functioning through the lifespan.

A very few males are born with a genetic mutation to the gene that produces aromatase and their bodies, while having the full male component of testosterone, have no estrogen in circulation. These males provide a natural experiment.

There are real structural differences between a normal "male brain" and a "female brain" that can be discerned with functional magnetic resonance imaging (fMRI). The blood-brain barrier prevents estrogen crossing into the developing brain of a fetus. It does not, however, prevent testosterone from crossing the barrier. In a male fetus, testosterone in the brain is converted to estrogen by the aromatase enzyme and it is crucial in creating a "male brain." The "female brain" is formed in the absence of estrogen!

An aromatase-deficient male goes through normal male puberty with the expected growth of penis, testicles, prostate gland, etc. He produces viable sperm. However, in the absence of estrogen in the testicles, the sperm are of low quality and tend not to be very motile, leading to low fertility. His libido, however, will be that of a normal male.

One critical role of estrogen that was discovered through these aromatase=deficient males was that they did not go through the normal adolescent growth spurt. Their long bones, though, continue to grow throughout their lifespan. What are termed "eunuchoid" body characteristics in macroskeletal development are a result of lack of estrogen, not lack of testosterone. Estrogen treatment for aromatase-deficient males causes their long bones to stop growing.

Some of the important changes that come as a result of castration of the adult male are a result of loss of estrogen, not loss of testosterone. The most important ones are hot flashes, osteoporosis, and some changes in memory and cognitive processing (e.g., spatial memory, mental rotation). A small dose of estrogen, to replace that which the male would normally produce by conversion from testosterone, can reverse these effects.

Some other changes are from loss of testosterone, however, such as loss of body hair below the neck, loss of muscle strength and gynocomastia (breast growth). Most Male-to-Female individuals are chagrined to learn that even massive doses of estrogen do not do much to aid breast growth beyond what lack of testosterone does in adult males. (Estrogen does have a major effect on breast growth during female puberty, however, just not after the completion of puberty.)

There is speculation that some of the "loss of energy" in castrated males is a result of loss of estrogen, rather than loss of testosterone. This is true for castrated male rats, though there is not yet sufficient data on human beings.

A few selected references for anyone who wishes to pursue the subject:

Finklestein, J.S., H. Lee, S.M. Burnett-Bowie, J.C. Pallais, E.W. Yu, L.F. Borges, B.F. Jones, C.V. Barry, K.E. Wulczyn, B.J. Thomas, and B. Z. Leder. 2013. Gonadal steroids and body composition, strength, and sexual function in men. New England Journal of Medicine 368:1011-1022.

McCarthy, M. M. 2008. Estradiol and the developing brain. Physiological Reviews 88 (1):91-124.

Rochira, V., and C. Carani. 2009. Aromatase deficiency in men: a clinical perspective. Nature Review Endocrinology 5 (10):559-68.

Scott, E., Q. G. Zhang, R. Wang, R. Vadlamudi, and D. Brann. 2012. Estrogen neuroprotection and the critical period hypothesis. Frontiers in Neuroendocrinology 33 (1):85-104.

Wibowo, E., S. Deurveilher, R. J. Wassersug, and K. Semba. 2012. Estradiol treatment modulates spontaneous sleep and recovery after sleep deprivation in castrated male rats. Behavioural Brain Research 226 (2):456-64.

[jcat (imported)]

Interesting. Certainly my experience with low energy is that the estrogen injections compensate for it and I am energised again. Not all eunuchs want the breast growth that goes with higher levels of estrogen. What would be interesting is finding a minimum dose or estrogen rich diet that may help. I suspect we are all different and it will always be a case of experimentation.

Is it possible that this can be helped by diet? A new product in the supermarket called 'Eunuch Bars" !!

[Riverwind (imported)]

So maybe a little E not T could help? So now how what should I try to get that E in my system?

I know, this is going to be a long day of research.

River

[devi (imported)]

I myself take the the minimal doseage of estradiol recommended for menopause in tablet form. I actually take more like one every other day though along with my vitamins. And it does seem to help. (In theory and in the old days you could get by with certain greens and herbs for menopause but the pills are so much easier and available in today's world.)

[jcat (imported)]

Thinking about this all day..... If it is the case that a little E helps, surely diet can minimise the amount of E supplement needed if the diet contains more estrogen rich foods? It would be really interesting to see if members here started to eat more of the below whether they feel more energised. Of course a proper dietician in the camp would help. They say you are what you eat. Any volunteers?

I found this today:

http://www.stylecraze.com/articles/estrogen-rich-foods/

1. Flax seeds:

Flaxseeds are also commonly referred to as linseed. The phytoestrogens present in them are referred to as lignans. The seeds are generally ground and used in breads, cereals and salads to boost the absorption rate. Linseed has the most quantity of phytoestrogens: 379,380 mcg per 100 g. There are about 85.5 mg lignans in one ounce of linseed.

2. Tofu:

Tofu, also called bean curd is produced from soymilk and is high in phytoestrogens called isoflavones. Tofu is available in soft to firm varieties and may be used in soups and certain main courses. 3 ounces of tofu offers 20 mg of isoflavones or 27,150.1mcgof phytoestrogens per 100 g.

3. Soybeans:

Soybeans are one of the richest sources of phytoestrogens. The intake of foods rich in estrogen like these is known to provide relief from the symptoms of menstrual cycle in women. Edamame are the pods which are produced by soy plant. These are a great choice for snack as they pack a nutritional punch. One cup contains 24 mg of isoflavone or 103,920 mcg of phytoestrogen per 100 g.

4. Soy yogurt:

Soy yogurt or bean curd yogurt is the yogurt made from soy milk. A cup of this yoghurt contains about21mg of isoflavones or 10,275 mcg of phytoestrogens per 100 g.

5. Sesame seeds:

Sesame seeds also contain phytoestrogens known as lignans. These are used to make a wide variety of dishes and can also be sprinkled on top of certain appetizers. One ounce of sesame seeds contain 11.2 mg of lignans, or 8008.1mcg of phytoestrogens 100 g.Comparatively,sunflower seeds or helianthus seeds have less phytoestrogens, with 216mcg per 100g.

6. Multi-grain bread:

Whole grains like oats, barley, rye and wheat have phytoestrogens known as lignans. The number of units per weight depends on the concentration of the whole grains in the bread.

7. Soymilk:

Soy milk is a beverage made from soy beans. It is rich in phytoestrogens called flavones. One cup of soy milk contains about 30 mg of flavones or 2,957.2 mcg phytoestrogens per 100 g.

8. Hummus:

Hummus is a type of food made using boiled and mashed chickpeas. It can be used as a dip or a spread. It provides 993 mcg of phytoestrogens per 100 g.

9. Garlic:

Garlic which belongs to the onion family is also a source of isoflavonoids with about603.3mcg of phytoestrogens per 100 g.It is one of ingredients which is widely used in cuisines the world over.

10. Dried apricots, dates and prunes:

Dried apricots are a far higher supply of phytoestrogens than natural apricots. Dried apricots contain 445.5 mcg of phytoestrogens per 100 g. Dried dates with 329.5 mg of isoflavoids per 100g and dried prunes with 177.5mcg per 100 g are also good sources of estrogen.

Eating a diet rich in the above mentioned products along with good quantities of fruits and vegetables would not only ensure a smooth transition into menopause for women, but also safeguard their overall health and well-being.

[devi (imported)]

Maybe for a modern on the run, have a life diet the minimal dose for post-menopause (and eunuchs) of "conjugated estrogens" is 0.3mg a day or if you have those 0. 625mg pills rather than splitting them you could take one on M/W/F. Synthetic estradiol for some reason is at 0.5 instead of 0.3mg. For phyto-estrogens which is also rather necessary you can find alfalfa, kale other green tablets at grocery stores or for a higher price at health food stores. Only a few a day of those is pretty much what you need. The excess is overkill. A multi-vitamin pill is not a bad idea either but the ones without iron. Excess iron is detrimental. Calcium is somewhat debatable. Oh yes and do try to eat right but then again people that are living longest seem to be the ones that are enjoying the most out of life especially that of eating out with others.

[Mac (imported)]

Have to make an effort to find and eat some of those foods.