Unbroken, by Laura Hillenbrand

[punkypink (imported)]

Punky, when you talk of being anti-superficial, what exactly do you mean?

I think that to aspire to be anti-superficial is a good thing. You mean to look at people for what they bring to the table on the inside rather than the outside, correct?

I have spoken about being superficial myself in the past, in the sense that I believe a female has to have been of a certain level of attractiveness to potentially attract me, and then win my heart. Are you wanting to change this in humans (so that we can potentially attracted by anyone), or are you saying that humans are not as superficial as I am?

Or do you mean that too many people crave the most expensive cars, furniture, jewellery and houses? Personally, this side of things I care little about, so wouldn't consider myself superficial in that way.

Though I still desire my own roof over my head and car, I don't care to ever live in a mansion or drive a mercedes.

I have not read many of your posts, but what I have seen I have liked. I hope that you continue to share your mind on the EA.

I like the EA, even though I probably don't fit in with 80% of the conversation. Some of the stuff on here is very enlightening. It possibly helps that I am not someone to gets very offended often; I would consider that one of my strongest points. I don't think that I have felt offended yet on the EA...yet

"Over-confidence in anonymity." Fair point Cainanite. But I don't think that the suffering side of things from this is the only effect. Anonymity allows people the courage to express themselves (which often can be a positive) who otherwise wouldn't. Even for me, though I go under my real name (combined), I am as good as anonymous. It's not as if I am going to bump into anyone at work who reads my posts!

There are at least a couple of members on here who have really trusted me with private information about themselves in private messages; I am very grateful that they felt able to open up to me like that.

As for politics; I was blessed without the brain power required to understand most of those discussions, thus I avoid those threads by default, and my skin remains so perfect that I should be called Maybelline Boy

Ignorance is bliss

Basically the premise of judging a book by the contents not the cover. There are lots of people here for example, who're into women but will not even give a trans woman a fair look in, especially if they have the "wrong" genitals. I'm willing to bet lots of people into men will not give trans men the same chance either. They claim it is how they're wired. But hell, I used to find the male physique unattractive and even repulsive, but now I understand that gender and sex are 2 distinct categories, I've stopped seeing genitals as "male or female" and that the only thing that matters about them is that they belong to someone I like as a person and that actually makes the idea of ah....playing with it a very attractive prospect. Maybe I've reprogrammed my brain, and I do believe that others are able to do it too despite claims that they're wired that way. But they don't want to try. It's really sad.

Interesting point you've brought up about material comforts btw. I would love to own many material items, but less as a symbol of status, more because I would enjoy them very much. As far as expensive cars go, I'd love the fast ones, not the huge opulent ones, because of what they can do and how enjoyable they are going fast. I also marvel and admire the technology within those fast cars, and if I owned something like a McLaren Mp4-12/c it would not be used in the city to show off, but rather be used on the circuits for the sheer joy of driving. Within the city something small and humble would be much more sensible anyway, especially since I live in London.

Other things I'd love to own would be houses with a distinct architectural style that I can enjoy or a history that fascinates me or with technology that makes captures the imagination. I'd love to own a yacht because I really love the sea, I love the ingenuity in design especially with smaller boats and how they can fit everything you need in, and the idea of being able to get away from a society that I truly quite despise at the moment.

[punkypink (imported)]

Anyways I just posted in another medium a short explanation about superficiality and passive discrimination. Hope that makes it easier to understand.

Society is still a very superficial one, where people are judged by how they are physically than who they are inside, and then consider that there are many people who are still discriminated against passively for various reasons.

Ask yourself how many people would give a fair chance of going past platonic to people who're physically missing an arm/leg etc?

How many people would give a fair chance of going past platonic to people who're physically deformed for one reason or another?

Hell, how many people would give a fair chance of going past platonic to transgendered people who are pre-op or non-op?

For most people they'll draw the line at a platonic association and call that "acceptance" when they've already made the decision to never go past platonic solely on the physical aspects of the person.

For these physically "disadvantaged" people there is truly no place on earth where they can find a society with at least 50% of people who're prepared to not make a decision on whether they can move past platonic based on physical traits alone.

[vesal_mas (imported)]

Maybe just a silly question.

If castration, orchiectomy, occured until recently, where are all those eunuchs then ?

Take care.

Vesal.

[loveableleopardy (imported)]

I have to be going to work now, but I must say that Punky rocks!

Hope to reply properly to your interesting posts later.

[punkypink (imported)]

Maybe just a silly question.

If castration, orchiectomy, occured until recently, where are all those eunuchs then ?

Take care.

Vesal.

very possibly, dead. i doubt the system would have given them that much post-castration care, and we know that depriving the body of T often leads to clinical depression. I'd bet at least a few of them offed themselves.

[Cainanite (imported)]

Maybe just a silly question.

If castration, orchiectomy, occured until recently, where are all those eunuchs then ?

Take care.

Vesal.

The shame involved would have pushed many of them underground. Many of them don't speak out about what happened to them. I remember seeing a program on PBS that talked about this issue. I must have seen it 15 years ago or more. They interviewed this old fellow that spoke about his experience. He was in a children's home, and was 17 years old. He was looking forward to being released. The nurses took him for an "examination" and before he knew it, he had been knocked out and sterilized. He called it "Cut". (whether he meant vasectomized or castrated I don't know.) he did say he never married, and has lived most of his life in shame over what happened to him.

He wasn't feeble minded or a trouble maker. He was just a 17 year old orphan who trusted his caregivers. He was never told why he was sterilized.

They exist among us for sure. They are just ashamed and staying quiet. Many of them may not even know what happened to them. There were a lot of female victims who wouldn't know. Most of them were never told what that operation was.

I knew of at least one old fellow who was in the old-folks home with my maternal grandmother. The two had struck up a friendship, and he eventually confided to her, (when she misinterpreted his friendship as a desire for something more) that he had been castrated as a young man (and wasn't a threat to her.) She reacted badly and broke off the friendship. My mother told me the story, when I wanted to know why Grandma was acting so distant and upset.

My mother thought it was horrible for my Grandmother. Never a thought was spared for the old fellow. The story made me mad, and I had a hard time forgiving my Grandmother for shunning the old fellow. He confided something painful to his only friend in that facility. She shunned him for it.

I think that was the attitude of that generation. I don't expect there are many victims willing to tell their tale for fear of what might happen to them.

I wish I knew what happened to that old guy, but he only spoke French (which I don't) so we wouldn't have had much to say to each other anyway. Still I regret not learning more. He passed away with no family or friends in the world. Makes me sad.

I believe they are still out there, among us. Just don't expect them to become EA members and brag about their experience. I'm not sure anybody on the EA, TRULY understands something like being forcibly castrated or sterilized against your will. We tend to celebrate or idolize the experience. This wouldn't be the place they'd feel comfortable sharing, especially not that generation.

[JesusA (imported)]

Maybe just a silly question.

If castration, orchiectomy, occured until recently, where are all those eunuchs then ?

Just a short bit to add to Cainanite's fine response. From various lines of analysis, my research colleague and I have determined that there are 8,000 to 12,000 voluntary eunuchs in the U.S. and Canada today. Where are they? Those who frequent the Eunuch Archive are part of that group. How many here are out to the general public? These are the ones who WANTED to be castrated. Think about those who were castrated against their will....

[punkypink (imported)]

The shame involved would have pushed many of them underground. Many of them don't speak out about what happened to them. I remember seeing a program on PBS that talked about this issue. I must have seen it 15 years ago or more. They interviewed this old fellow that spoke about his experience. He was in a children's home, and was 17 years old. He was looking forward to being released. The nurses took him for an "examination" and before he knew it, he had been knocked out and sterilized. He called it "Cut". (whether he meant vasectomized or castrated I don't know.) he did say he never married, and has lived most of his life in shame over what happened to him.

He wasn't feeble minded or a trouble maker. He was just a 17 year old orphan who trusted his caregivers. He was never told why he was sterilized.

They exist among us for sure. They are just ashamed and staying quiet. Many of them may not even know what happened to them. There were a lot of female victims who wouldn't know. Most of them were never told what that operation was.

I knew of at least one old fellow who was in the old-folks home with my maternal grandmother. The two had struck up a friendship, and he eventually confided to her, (when she misinterpreted his friendship as a desire for something more) that he had been castrated as a young man (and wasn't a threat to her.) She reacted badly and broke off the friendship. My mother told me the story, when I wanted to know why Grandma was acting so distant and upset.

My mother thought it was horrible for my Grandmother. Never a thought was spared for the old fellow. The story made me mad, and I had a hard time forgiving my Grandmother for shunning the old fellow. He confided something painful to his only friend in that facility. She shunned him for it.

I think that was the attitude of that generation. I don't expect there are many victims willing to tell their tale for fear of what might happen to them.

I wish I knew what happened to that old guy, but he only spoke French (which I don't) so we wouldn't have had much to say to each other anyway. Still I regret not learning more. He passed away with no family or friends in the world. Makes me sad.

I believe they are still out there, among us. Just don't expect them to become EA members and brag about their experience. I'm not sure anybody on the EA, TRULY understands something like being forcibly castrated or sterilized against your will. We tend to celebrate or idolize the experience. This wouldn't be the place they'd feel comfortable sharing, especially not that generation.

Reading this made me feel very very sad.

[vesal_mas (imported)]

Tx a lot, Cainanite, for this elaborated answer.

It cleared up things a lot.

I feel you're a good guy.

Vesal.

[justjustin (imported)]

You are very wise, Cainanite. I admire you verymuch.