The little boy who started a sex change aged eight

[Twinsenboy (imported)]

The little boy who started a sex change aged eight because he (and his lesbian parents) knew he always wanted to be a girl

Parents say it's better for Thomas to have sex change before he is adult

By Daily Mail Reporter

Last updated at 12:04 PM on 30th September 2011

The lesbian parents of an 11-year-old boy who is undergoing the process of becoming a girl last night defended the decision, claiming it was better for a child to have a sex change when young.

Thomas Lobel, who now calls himself Tammy, is undergoing controversial hormone blocking treatment in Berkeley, California to stop him going through puberty as a boy.

But Pauline Moreno and Debra Lobel warn that children with gender identity disorder forced to postpone transitioning could face a higher risk of suicide.

The mothers say that one of the first things Thomas told them when he learned sign language aged three - because of a speech impediment - was, 'I am a girl'.

At age seven, after threatening genital mutilation on himself, psychiatrists diagnosed Thomas with gender identity disorder. By the age of eight, he began transitioning.

This summer, he started taking hormone-blocking drugs, which will stop him from experiencing puberty.

The hormone-suppressant, implanted in his upper left arm, will postpone the 11-year-old developing broad shoulders, deep voice and facial hair.

The couple faced intense criticism from friends and family as a result, Ms Moreno told MailOnline.

'Everybody was angry with us. "How could you be doing this? You might be ruining his whole life!"

Citing a statistic from the Youth Suicide Prevention Program, Ms Moreno noted over 50 per cent of transgender youth will have had at least one suicide attempt by their 20th birthday.

From: dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2043345/The-California-boy-11-undergoing-hormone-blocking-treatment.html#ixzz1ZXcwtP41

What do you guys think of this?

[JesusA (imported)]

Kristoff and I spent about an hour over lunch one day at the WPATH conference speaking with a psychiatrist who is dealing with a 12 year-old who is now on hormone blockers to prevent puberty while he is in counseling. He has clearly indicated that he does not feel himself to be “male,” but it’s very unclear whether or not he is “female.” The psychiatrist was very much interested in information on Male-to-Eunuch as a possible direction.

At one of the paper sessions, there was a presentation by a counselor who discussed a 7 year-old who has tried to remove his penis with nail clippers. The counselor only saw Male-to-Female as a possible reason. I suggested BIID as a more likely diagnosis for one so young.

Kristoff and I both had several discussions with urologists, psychiatrists, and other counselors who were interested in both BIID and MtE. There should gradually be better awareness out there, though there is still a long way to go.

[erikboy (imported)]

I can imagine how this case will be used to show everyone that gay parents will turn their children gays... I wonder why straight parents turn their children gay sometimes?

I really do aprechiate your work Jesus and Kristoff!!

We'll see if MtE will be equal to other official t's.

[asphalt-cowboy (imported)]

When I was (very) young, had a strong feeling that I have something extra between the legs, something that has no place there. It was primarily about the penis, because the bag was still less evident below. At first it was a very very strong desire to see that those elements disappear. I grew up and started various tortures and now I wonder how I could tolerate such pain. At 6-7 years old play with a neighbor girl the same age and in the evening if we were alone in the dark we explore each other sexual organs. One of the things that I still remember well is that I repeatedly asked her to take a knife and cut them off. She was willing to do many things, but not so much. And I did not have the courage to do it because I knew I could not carry out because of pain. I tried several times. With the parents may not be able to discuss such issues openly, as it does in the article quoted child.

Meanwhile I grew and gradually I got used to the way I look. And as my body works. I must admit that standing urination is very convenient in most cases. You can do almost anytime if needed and almost anywhere, much easier than a girl. As a child I had many female hobbies (sewing, playing with dolls) and male (football, cars). I am at peace with myself, and any thought of sex change is at most a pale fantasy. Castration and penectomy fantasy is much stronger.

I sit and think sometimes that the very strong memories of the early years of life when I had no where to know about the other sex, were a legacy from a previous life. I believe in previous live I was a girl. This is the only reason for believing in reincarnation, my own memories. I have read many cases of young children who know and do things that they had no where to learn. When you are small you may have memories of previous lives, until they are overwritten by other more intense in the present life. From this point of view I think it is very dangerous to encourage any transgender intention when it comes to young children. Most times they will adapt to the body had to be as happy as possible. If at the age of 5-7 years I could discuss the subject as the child we are talking about, I am convinced that I got free way to change sex. And maybe at that age it seemed to me that is exactly what I want. Now I am absolutely sure that there is no way for me to be happy with a not working female body and I feel perfect with a perfectly functional male body. I have only some fantasies, but we all have, right?

[transward (imported)]

It is important to realize that these are not simple cases and there may not be any clearcut right decision. For a doctor the overriding factor has to be "above all, do no harm." The current protocols for dealing with gender variant kids is to do nothing that cannot be reversed before they are clearly of an age to make a mature and informed decision on their own. Usually this consists in blocking puberty until about fifteen or sixteen, then if they still feel that way, to begin cross gender hormones. Then at somewhere between 18 - 21 surgery can be considered.

In the case in post#1, The parents' status as lesbians raises a few questions. Certainly gay parents have the same chance of having a trans kid as the general population of parents. I have known lots of lesbian parents, and they did an excellent job. That being said, I have known a few man hating lesbians, who despised penises almost as much as they loathed the people they were attached to, and whom I would not want to see anywhere near young minds. (Oddly enough, quite a few of these were post-op trans women. Check out some of the "Women Born Transsexual" blogs for their rants about the evils of "penis people.") Were I a doctor, and a case like this presented, with man hating parents, I would proceed with extreme caution till I was sure the kid wasn't mind washed by her parents.

Kristoff and I spent about an hour over lunch one day at the WPATH conference speaking with a psychiatrist who is dealing with a 12 year-old who is now on hormone blockers to prevent puberty while he is in counseling. He has clearly indicated that he does not feel himself to be “male,” but it’s very unclear whether or not he is “female.” The psychiatrist was very much interested in information on Male-to-Eunuch as a possible direction.

At one of the paper sessions, there was a presentation by a counselor who discussed a 7 year-old who has tried to remove his penis with nail clippers. The counselor only saw Male-to-Female as a possible reason. I suggested BIID as a more likely diagnosis for one so young.

Kristoff and I both had several discussions with urologists, psychiatrists, and other counselors who were interested in both BIID and MtE. There should gradually be better awareness out there, though there is still a long way to go.

I question the possibility of a MtE identity much before puberty. I have listened to hundreds of gender variant people talking about their childhood. The world of the child before puberty is very much a gender binary. Well before they know the specifics about the difference, children are dividing people into boys and girls. They can be quite open to crossing over or blending the two (Wearing your cowboy chaps with your princess tiara for instance) but they seem to have trouble with the idea of having neither. Perhaps that is because there is no public role for eunuchs in our society, but even in societies with many eunuchs, they wore normally gendered clothes, male clothes for harem guards and Chinese eunuchs, womens clothes for Middle Eastern public belly dancers and Indian hejiras. I would assume the boy is being treated because he was exibiting cross gendered behavior; I have seen none treated for being non-gendered. So I would be curious to know what caused the therapist to question the child's identification as girlish.

I have read most of the narratives here on the EA of those who identify as MtE. I observe that they came to that identification (of necessity) post puberty. At puberty we go from being gendered to being sexually gendered. The MtE identification seems a rejection of that sexuallity more than a rejection of a gender.

The child that tried to castrate himself seem a typical victom of a typical narritive. You identify as a girl at an early age.

Child : I am a girl.

Parent: You can't be a girl."

Child "Why not?"

Parent: "You have a penis, girls don't have a penis."

And Child, like all children being a literalist, makes the obvious conclusion. "If I chop it off, then I will be a girl."

Transward

[Twinsenboy (imported)]

I feel that there's a difference between being gay and being trans..

Being gay is like, I want other males to notice me for the other man I am, and maybe my big cock.. which looks pretty male, not female.

Being trans.. isn't that like.. you want other men to notice how female you can be?

It's arguable, but in western societies it now seems very much like our own manhood and masculinity isn't exactly appreciated or motivated anymore..

If it was just good-hearted individuals who wanted a better life, I'd have no problem with such decicions, but.. the risk is that somebody else might benefit from all this, too, except in another much more wicked large-scale way.

When I, Twinsenboy, was a child, I wished I had been born a girl, because I often identified more with my mom than my dad, and I thought it was easier to understand women rather than men, cause my dad made a biggest of efforts not to be completely understood, just obeyed, as he yelled for nothing and seemingly never forgave anything.. Just to guilt me and give me a bad conscience. Men were mean. Though I don't think he has ever realized it, my dad was sometimes a big baby, big strong scary baby, a dangerous wussy! My mom was overbearing etc., so evened out, I guess it was kiiinda like growing up with two lesbian mothers? I love them both, don't get me wrong, but this is what I always tried so desperately to ignore. Now though, if I had been bodily modified back then, I don't know WHO I'd be suing today, but I sure would hate everybody for not helping me psychologically to love my own body and gender, instead of giving in to my physical wishes, cause what I wished the most, of course, was just to be like all the other boys and to fit in, you know. And to be truthfully told that I am good ENOUGH just being me. Ironically though, the ones who have given me the toughest times, have been crazy girls and women. Being hetero is not me living in denial.. For ME, being gay is. I remember deciding to start denying women when I was rejected by my childhood girlfriend when we became teens. And denial of playing around with dicks together with my buddies.. thinking it all meant something greater ang got stuck on those thoughts, which "paused" me throughout puberty. Arrested development, anyone? Thankfully, nature's own living psilocybe mushrooms have given me the best reparative therapy imaginable though. And that's not me condoning anything, just being honest. Now, I once again love the feeling of knowing that I am stronger than any conceited girl out there, and all I want to do is find somebody to protect and love. Might also add that I've often been like, whenever something is popular enough, whether it's a movie, music or simply opinions, I've looked elsewhere, to find something else that is just as great but hasn't gotten the same amount of deserved attention. Just to broaden my perspectives. That way I've also made friends with people who didn't easily get friends, cause I've always been like, if somebody around me isn't happy yet, I am not happy yet. This goes for these posts too, I just wanna make sure we don't overlook anything. It's children we're talking surgery for here, after all! I have overcome my own childhood psycho terrors.. You understand and forgive, not only for their sake, but for your own sake as well. If you accept, others will, too. Since we ARE Love, to me it's no wonder that's the real fuel for life.

[moi621 (imported)]

Chaz Bono stories are of wishing to be a boy since early childhood.

With careful selection I can see where it might be easier to transgender

in childhood then as an adult.

Moi

for sharing your very academic works.

[Charlotte (imported)]

For those of you who are not transgender it will be harder to recognize the benefit of such early transition. The older one is (mtf) when beginning hormone therapy the better the results and the closer to puberty, the better also. The people I've seen who had parents that responded to the childs GID with early medical intervention are so successful in their transition that they are undetectable.

Delaying puberty when GID is a likely possibility is probably the kindest thing that can be done for the child. http://www.observer.com/2008/arts-cultu ... l-new-york

[_g (imported)]

Personal I feel that not a thing should be done (surgery or hormone therapy) and delaying puberty to make sure there is not any out side force pushing the child into this decision so early.

_g

[Charlotte (imported)]

Well, I had it right in my head but somehow said the opposite. What I meant to say was that the older one is

when beginning hormone therapy the

less the results are. From my experience being around ftm's they have generally better results taking T than mtf's taking E, all other things such as age being the same.

For those of you who are not transgender it will be harder to recognize the benefit of such early transition. The older one is (mtf) when beginning hormone therapy the better the results and the closer to puberty, the better also. The people I've seen who had parents that responded to the childs GID with early medical intervention are so successful in their transition that they are undetectable.

Delaying puberty when GID is a likely possibility is probably the kindest thing that can be done for the child. http://www.observer.com/2008/arts-cultu ... l-new-york